Me too, Gordon. But like a dog with a big food interest and a bag of tricks, I sometimes hear myself say them and a few moments later am admonished that I did the wrong trick! You can really get caught out when you just kinda sorta know what it means and don't look it up. I do know what this one means but I once complimented a colleague (read brother carpenter) on having very catholic interests and he was a bit put off. Thought I meant big C.

jack