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ed good #603471 09/26/21 09:12 AM
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Ed, I remember going to fox drives when all sorts of agricultural folks would turn up and I've seen the odd puff of smoke come out of the side of the barrels. I guess a lot of these old guns have now gone to rest. It used to be common practice at the big estate houses that the boss would use the 'Purdey' until it was getting past its best and a new one would be bought. The old gun would then go to the Gamekeeper and well used until he received the later one passed down and then it would go to the Gardener for use against pests. Stored in the potting shed until the woodworm and rust saw it off. I think the worst example I ever saw; which I wish I had photographed, was a Boss hammer ejector. I had been re-stocked with a piece of timber normally seen holding fence wire in place. The barrels pitted inside and out and dented. The rust made it difficult to see any of the engraving and details. I almost wept! There was nothing that was remotely salvageable. A Boss hammer ejector that I doubt anyone on this forum would have given 10 dollars for and only then as a curiosity. Lagopus.....

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ksauers1 #603484 09/26/21 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by ksauers1
Originally Posted by Stanton Hillis
Originally Posted by ed good
stan, recently, an avid shooter i know of had a scary experience...seems like he occasionally shot skeet with a 12 gauge parker hammer gun with damascus barrels, using light smokeless loads...been doing so for quite awhile...well this summer, he was shooting as usual, when one of the barrels erupted, with a few inches of barrel being blown out...fortunately, no one was hurt...one never knows when one of these old guns is going to let go...if one must shoot guns with twist steel barrels, then do so only occasionally...and then only use shells loaded with powder the gun was designed for...ie: black powder...

and as for shooting .017 or similar thin barrel walls...a barrel blockage of any kind or a severe barrel dent will cause pressures to increase rapidly...in that situation, the thinner the barrel walls, the more likely there will be a bulge or eruption...i would think...

That reply is so full of assumptions I won't even begin to address them. And, it didn't even begin to answer the question I asked.


So there is no such thing as nitro proved Damascus barrels?

[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]

Wall thickness...
(R) 3” from breech .105, 9” from breech .58, 13” from breech .43, 6” from muzzle .37
(L) 3” from breech .105, 9” from breech .57, 13” from breech .44, 6” from muzzle .36

Last edited by battle; 09/26/21 11:29 AM.
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battle #603498 09/26/21 01:37 PM
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I know it has been mentioned before on this forum that many of the American manufacturers at the turn of the 2oth century clearly stated that their damascus guns were just as safe with the new nitro powders as were the fluid steel built ones. Anything we do in life usually involves some sort of risk on a daily basis, from the food we eat, to the cars we drive, etc., etc. I will continue to shoot my damascus guns guns with low pressure smokeless loads because I feel they are safe for me and because I have done the research on my guns and deem them to be so. Your mileage may vary!


"As for me and my house we will shoot Damascus!"
ed good #603503 09/26/21 03:56 PM
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nice to know about guns you consider as safe to shoot...but the subject of this thread is about specific guns you consider to be unsafe to shoot...


keep it simple and keep it safe...
ed good #603516 09/26/21 05:30 PM
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I would disagree. This thread is about "unsafe" guns...whatever that means to different people. What one person considers safe another might not.


"As for me and my house we will shoot Damascus!"
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Carl46 #603526 09/26/21 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Carl46
Marlin has advised owners of their old hammer pump guns that they are unsafe to shoot. I don't recall exactly why, but it seems like there was something about firing out of battery.

It's been almost 20 years so the details are a little fuzzy, but there was a period SASS Cowboy shooting where Marlin hammered pumps were allowed. There was a specific model when if it wasn't assembled correctly and/or checked on a frequent basis one of the safety features could fail which IIRC could cause the gun to fire out of battery causing the bolt to come out the back of the gun, hitting the shooter. This caused SASS to ban all pump shotguns except the Winchester 1897 in either 12 or 16 gauge and any replicas in those two calibers. The Marlins weren't very common and I only remember two couples who used them versus the hundreds of people who used the Winchester 1897.

Marlin, which had no control over these old guns and what ammo might be used, correctly covered themselves legally by saying the guns should no longer be used. The Winchesters did not have this design issue and apparently the Winchester company that made the 1897 pump shoguns had changed hand so many times that they could not be held liable even if there was an accident with a 1897 pump.


I have become addicted to English hammered shotguns to the detriment of my wallet.
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Originally Posted by Stanton Hillis
Originally Posted by ed good
12bore, shooting smokeless in a damascus gun is pushing it...doing so in such light barrels, is even more risky...

.017 seven inches down in a 16 is risky and could easily result in a bulge or an eruption if even a slight blockage occurs...

you were lucky shooting both guns...

other opinions?

Yeah, here's mine. You're full of it. It didn't result in "an eruption", obviously. Why didn't it, ed, if it was unsafe?

Calm down Stanley Ed didn't say anything bad about your ground swatting covey shooting grandpappy.

HomelessjOe #603644 09/28/21 02:51 PM
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Luck has nothing to do with it. Being knowledeable of what you have is the important thing. It has been shown thru pressue testing that the pressure at 10" or less from the muzzle of most low pressure loads is 2000 p.s.i. or less. Definately no danger of of an eruption or even a bulge.


"As for me and my house we will shoot Damascus!"
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