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#6888 - 10/17/05 09:41 PM Sabot slugs ????
John Mann Offline
Sidelock
***

Registered: 12/31/01
Posts: 5257
Loc: Mountains of New Hampshire
Is it necessary to have a barrel rifled all the way to shoot sabot slugs ???
I an thinking of having rifled screw-ins put in a 20 gauge SxS and shooting sabot slugs.
What is your thinking on this?
Best,
John
_________________________
Humble member of the League of Extraodinary Gentlemen (LEG). Joined 14 March, 2006. Member #1.

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#6889 - 10/17/05 09:59 PM Re: Sabot slugs ????
KY Jon Offline
Sidelock
**

Registered: 03/09/02
Posts: 6432
Loc: Red State
Your choke ideal is a throwback. Isn't this a variation of the Paradox rifling? You would think that it would be hard to get enough spin in a short choke tube but it does work. H&H and several French makers used a rifled choke area for slugs.

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#6890 - 10/17/05 10:39 PM Re: Sabot slugs ????
Marrakai Offline
Member
*****

Registered: 11/29/02
Posts: 522
Loc: Northern Territory, Australia
John:
My (limited!) understanding is that rifled choke-tubes were designed specifically for saboted slugs, by all makers including Cation et al. Even if that were not the case, they should work just fine.

In the spirit of this board, just do it!, then report back...
_________________________
Marrakai
http://www.hotkey.net.au/~orrs/Marrakai

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#6891 - 10/18/05 06:47 AM Re: Sabot slugs ????
Anonymous
Unregistered


I'm interested in doing the same . . . love to have a double with rifle sights for deer. What kind of 20 will you use?

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#6892 - 10/18/05 08:38 AM Re: Sabot slugs ????
popplecop Offline
Sidelock
**

Registered: 03/24/03
Posts: 578
Loc: Centeral Wis.
John, I have two shotguns that have after market choke tubes installed (TruChoke) I had this done because of steel shot. I bought a Cation (?) rifled choke tube to try with sabots. It works very well and very accurate. Win. Supreme slugs were the most accurate of all I shot from the bench (ouch). Some years ago the American Rifleman had an article comparing them to fully rifled barrels. As I recall they were almost or as good, memory dims with age. Seldom use a shotgun for deer, but did shoot one adult doe at 75 yds. It went about another 75 yds. and piled up.

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#6893 - 10/18/05 09:15 AM Re: Sabot slugs ????
John Mann Offline
Sidelock
***

Registered: 12/31/01
Posts: 5257
Loc: Mountains of New Hampshire
wiredducker
The gun is a Stevens 311 that Stevens was experimenting with. Below are a couple os pics.
http://www.worldpath.net/~jmann/Stevens1.JPG
http://www.worldpath.net/~jmann/Stevens2.JPG
http://www.worldpath.net/~jmann/Stevens6.JPG
This very unusual site is designed by Nicols. Elmer Keith once wrote about. Seems that Stevens was thinking of the same thing that I questioned about but had not put in screwins.
Best,
John
_________________________
Humble member of the League of Extraodinary Gentlemen (LEG). Joined 14 March, 2006. Member #1.

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#6894 - 10/18/05 11:20 AM Re: Sabot slugs ????
JayCee Offline
Sidelock
***

Registered: 01/02/02
Posts: 3617
John, according to Remington, their Copper Solid Sabot Slugs should only be shot using a rifled barrel or rifled choke. One of those through a fully rifled 870 took care of a biggish wild boar.

On the other hand, I have in front of me a box of "SAGA Bala Expansiva" (http://www.saga.es/angles/home.html) that are specially made for use in smooth bores with any type of choke. I have tried them and they are very accurate and have fantastic penetration. According to the manufacturers they also work very well with rifling.

JC(AL)
_________________________
"...it is always advisable to perceive clearly our ignorance."¯ Charles Darwin

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#6895 - 10/18/05 12:09 PM Re: Sabot slugs ????
JayCee Offline
Sidelock
***

Registered: 01/02/02
Posts: 3617
John, your private message mailbox is currently full.

JC(AL)
_________________________
"...it is always advisable to perceive clearly our ignorance."¯ Charles Darwin

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#6896 - 10/18/05 02:15 PM Re: Sabot slugs ????
Tinker Offline
Sidelock
**

Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 863
Loc: Northern NV
I'm interested to hear what you come up with for a rifled choke tube -- specifically to work with whatever you have as bore dimensions in that gun.

Have you graphed the bores of that mysterious side by side yet?

Proper paradox guns are special critters. I'll be interested to see what you come up with and if you can get it to put both barrels in the same tidy little group.
Have you tried simply running factory rifled slugs through it? Some smooth bore slug guns do quite well without the rifling. If that gun was indeed set up with shooting slugs in mind, it's possible it will do well with the off the shelf loads.
If that is the case, rifled choke tubes might not be the thing to do to that gun.

I am also interested to see what the rear sight looks like on that gun.
I've seen that photo you have there of the blocky front sight. What's the rear like?


--Tinker

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#6897 - 10/18/05 07:01 PM Re: Sabot slugs ????
John Mann Offline
Sidelock
***

Registered: 12/31/01
Posts: 5257
Loc: Mountains of New Hampshire
Tinker et al
There is no rear sight. It would appear that the gun was unfinished as there is no evidence that any clors or blue were ever on it.
This sight is very interesting. When searching to an explanation of the gun , one fellow on the 24 Hour Campfire told me what it was and that he had seen a 12 gauge that was sold in this same clearing out at Stevens.
I will take your advice and test it befor I do anything to it.
Best,
John
_________________________
Humble member of the League of Extraodinary Gentlemen (LEG). Joined 14 March, 2006. Member #1.

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