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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/POBo9Dc.jpg) 1934 20 gauge Trap/Skeet As a Skeet shooter and a fan of the Model 21, I’m trying to understand the logic behind this early Trap/Skeet. Why the overlap between this gun and say the “New Fangled” Tournament Skeet (1933-1935) Dimensions are pretty much identical as is its’ configuration. Other than the Trap forend (longer and taller) what’s the difference?
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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The TRAP grade has checkered cheeks, slightly different checkering pattern, and fancier wood than the FIELD, SKEET, or TOURNAMENT grades. Some TOURNAMENT SKEET grade guns are indistinguishable from SKEET grade guns except for the factory build sheet. Not all are grade stamped.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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My TRAP grade Model 21 has exceptionally nice wood. But the way I always understood it, you could get anything on any Model 21 that you asked and paid for. My trap grade does not have the checkered panels. After the kidney pattern on the BTFE was changed, I have heard that if you wanted the kidney pattern put on the BTFE, they would go back and put it on the gun. So if you asked for fancy wood on something other than a TRAP grade, you could get it. From what I have always read and understood, you could always get any combination of features on any Winchester Model 21 that you wanted when you ordered it. Just because something was not standard on a certain grade of Model 21s, Winchester never refused to put a feature on a gun for you. At least that's the way I have always understood it. I am reading Ned Schwing's book AGAIN as we speak.
By the way, Bob, that's REALLY a nice gun.
Last edited by Jimmy W; 01/20/25 04:22 PM.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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True, but the vast majority of these things were made for a customer by the name of 'Stock'.
I think whatever logic there was behind the numerous variations was just to get variety to the dealers so the eventual buyers felt they were offered choices.
Winchester just kind of did what they wanted on the stock inventory guns, likely trying to match product with perceived trends.
"The price of good shotgunnery is constant practice" - Fred Kimble
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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I agree Shotgunjones. That is why they had the symbol numbers for different grades.......... But then again, every once in a while you will find a field grade 21 with a gold dog or bird on the trigger guard or some such combination and you'll know that Winchester would do just about anything for a special order gun if the customer ordered and paid the money for it. I was just reading about the kidney pattern on the forearms that were used until the early 1950s. The diamond shaped pattern was used until the end of the production era in 1959. But if someone went to Winchester in 1958 and said, "I want the kidney pattern on my forearm", I'll bet someone would be coming up with a kidney shaped pattern on a forearm. Wouldn't you think so? I have read that that happened. 
Last edited by Jimmy W; 01/20/25 07:35 PM.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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When I was a young man, Winchester would make your 21 your way. They even would make you guns no longer in the catalog, if they had the receiver on hand. My father was friends with their exhibition shooter and had him get a special order for a gun no longer in the catalog, long discontinued with features no longer available. Remington would do the same, out of their Custom Shop. I had them make me a 3200 four barrel set, long after they dropped the 3200 from their catalog. All you had to do was ask and pay for it. Worst they could do was tell you it was no longer available and I suspect when things were slow, everything was possible, if you brought money to the conversation.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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When I was a young man, Winchester would make your 21 your way. They even would make you guns no longer in the catalog, if they had the receiver on hand. My father was friends with their exhibition shooter and had him get a special order for a gun no longer in the catalog, long discontinued with features no longer available. Remington would do the same, out of their Custom Shop. I had them make me a 3200 four barrel set, long after they dropped the 3200 from their catalog. All you had to do was ask and pay for it. Worst they could do was tell you it was no longer available and I suspect when things were slow, everything was possible, if you brought money to the conversation. If you don't mind, which shooter was that? I'm guessing Herb Parsons.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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True, but the vast majority of these things were made for a customer by the name of 'Stock'... He owned this one! ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/n1v7zaH.png)
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Joined: Feb 2002
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Jimmy is right. Late TRAP grades did not normally have checkered cheeks.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Yes Herb Parsons. A real nice fellow, to a kid who was amazed with what he did with a gun, be it a .22 or a shotgun. I was very young back then but he seemed to hit everything he shot at. I was blessed in my father knew a wide range of people. Once met John Unitas on a fishing trip my father took him and his offensive line on. Or later Artie Donovan and three other Colt defensive players on another fishing trip off Ocean City Maryland. When you are a kid, those men were massive men, who you just were in awe of.
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