doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Leopold Bieder gun maker?

Has anyone heard of Leopold Bieder or Leopold Bieder Wien of Vienna?

I just bought a double by this maker from the latest Poulin auction:
https://www.invaluable.com/auction-...mpaign=lotwonlive&utm_content=178321

Looks good and I've always been happy with Poulin's descriptions, I'm just curious to learn more about the gun. A lot of the doubles in the Saturday auction came in below the listed minimum estimate.

If anyone else followed Saturdays's auction I'm curious if you think the bid prices were low or if possibly Poulin was optimistic about their estimates.

I also bought a gun in the auction, I think. I watched quite a few sell and thought their estimates were pretty much spot on with a few exceptions in each direction. The gun that I bought went for just below midrange. Most of those that I saw go low were low-grade guns to begin with.

It looks like a FN the engraving looks Belgian .I have a FN it's a really nice gun it has a boss type of intercepting sear machine made hand finished.looks like a great deal to me

I would agree. Looks very Belgian.

I concur, the 1930 Belgian proof marks are a strong clue.

Having said that the Belgians have always been capable of producing high quality guns and rifles.

Picked up the gun today from my FFL.

The wood looks better than the pictures, the nice brown you would expect from a decent piece of wood, not that yellow tone, presumably from lighting, in the pictures.

Gun locks up nice and tight.

While I doubt it would have changed anything, what wasn't mentioned in the description, is that the sling swivel on the barrel is missing and that the sling swivel in the stock had been removed and the hole filled.

You can have the barrel holes filled I have an FN that I restocked and I will fill the holes mine was mfg 1928 it's a great gun

If you would post full size in focus images of every mark on the action and barrel flats, and just forward of the flats, we might be able to provide more information, and possibly ID the maker
Or send them to me as jpg attachments - NOT embedded in the email. drewhausemd@yahoo.com

It's an FN

Cornell Pubs has 1928 & 1930 Fabrique Nationale catalog repros in English, French & German text.
The gun might be illustrated
https://cornellpubs.com/product/3633/
https://cornellpubs.com/product/3632/

Pics sent

Since the barrels have been re-blacked once already, at some point I will have the barrels sent to polished to remove the blemishes on the outside, the holes filled and then re-blacked again. It'll probably be a year or two, I already have one gun with the gunsmith being worked and refurbished.

I've bought a number of guns from Poulin and this is the first one where they missed something that should have been mentioned in the description. I certainly don't regret buying the gun.

Thanks and interesting.

Here is another 1930 demi-bloc FN
https://www.gunsinternational.com/g...lbs--4-oz---tough-g.cfm?gun_id=101114544

Chantry's gun does have 2 3/4" chambers
'i' is the 1930 lettre annale
The barrels at the time of proof weighed 1.371 Kg = 3.02 #. If > 3% less now (from honing) the barrels are considered out of proof



NORIS was a brandname used by Wilhelm Meyer Waffen in Nürnberg, established in 1920, and possibly still in business. Maybe Meyer supplied the gun to Leopold Bieder?
Acier special was the barrel steel tradename used by FN. "Special Steel" by Browning. Supplied by Cockerill.

The interesting part



After 1924 the muzzle measurement was not marked; just 'CHOKE' if > .08"
The tubes at the time of proof were 18.3 mm = .720"
They may have been honed at the time of reblacking and marked 18.4 = .724"
The arrow indicates what appears to be a 'phi' in the box, which is the lettre annale for 1961. It is likely that the gun was reproved then, in Belgium, not Germany.
What is the bore now, and what is the weight of the barrels?

Fun everything that can be learned from the Belgian marks. Neat gun

For those "gun makers" who actually had their guns made in the trade or otherwise outsourced, how many did they order? Did they order 6 or 12 at once, or maybe a gun was a one off? Using mine as an example, did Leopold Bieder order a standard FN gun and specify a certain engraving, LOP, drop and choke for one customer?

Wilhelm Meyer was a Büchsenmacherei und Großhandel in Waffen, etc. so he was a wholesaler.....

Serbus,

Raimey
rse

Some company's had trade catalogs showing engraving barrel,lengths FN was a giant company so I imagine you could get anything done or buy it in the white and out source the engraving stocking etc.i bought my FN for a project I restocked it eventually it will be engraved and checkering added.

After looking at the FN 1930 catalog again as well your link to the 1930 demi-bloc FN above, my gun has more in common with your link then the guns in the catalog. The guns in the catalog all side clips and the Greener cross bolt. Mine does not have side clips or the Greener cross bolt, but a hidden third bite. Not sure why I didn't notice before aside from the fact I can be remarkably dense at times.