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Keith,
What rifle do you have in 45-70?


Perry M. Kissam
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Originally Posted by Perry M. Kissam
Keith,
What rifle do you have in 45-70?

Perry, I will probably carry my Marlin 1895 .45-70 on the first couple days of rifle deer season. But I also have a Siamese Mauser converted to .45-70, a Wickliffe 76 single shot in .45-70, and an 1886 Trapdoor Springfield. I haven't fired the Trapdoor yet because it was missing the rear sight when I bought it.

Early on, I was a disciple of Roy Weatherby, and strongly believed in smaller calibers at high velocity. But when I started hunting with a flintlock, I quickly learned that those large diameter bullets or balls at relatively low black powder velocity killed all out of proportion to their rather anemic kinetic energy. It didn't make sense on paper, but having every deer I shot with it fall dead within a very few yards convinced me otherwise.

To me, the major advantage of carrying the Marlin 1985 versus the flintlock is that the Marlin has a Leupold 1-4x scope. Since the advent of antler restrictions in my state, I missed out on a number of bucks with the flintlock simply because I had to take extra time and make additional arm movements while counting points with binoculars. But if I had to choose to keep only one hunting rifle for the rest of my life, it would be a flintlock... without a doubt. And Flintlock Season is my absolute favorite.


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My experience very closely mirrors Keith's, only I began with a percussion m/l roundball rifle in '83. I found that a 237 gr. ball killed perfectly. When I bought a much used Ruger #3 in .45-70 and began reloading for it I used 300 gr. Rem. hollow points at 2100. There was a modest amount of recoil but it was manageable even for my 10 yr. old son who killed his first deer with it, and many more afterward. I sold it to buy a new Ruger #1 in the very same caliber, which I still have.

Those two rifles have taken scores of deer for him and me. All were anchored with one shot and all were recovered.


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I think the big slow bullet observation is true for deer but, maybe not so much for elk. Muzzleloaders have the reputation for not killing elk so good. As do slug guns. A lot of elk have been killed with .45-70's but that monster can kill pretty much anything.

My theory is the little high velocity bullet doesn’t have enough depth to work with in a deer. Usually a pass through and a bigger hole is better. In the elk it tumbles and change course through the big chest cavity, often not exiting, causing much trauma. Maybe that’s why a long and skinny bullet like the 6.5 Creedmoor can be so effective on elk -even though it isn't particularly powerful. All the energy is expended inside the elk.

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II had a Marlin 1895 Cowboy but sold it to a friend for his CAS long range rifle shooting. I kept the Marlin Alaskan Guide in wood and blue. I have hopes of shooting either a deer or an elk with the Pedersoli 45-70 Double Rifle I have or the Alaskan Guide. Of course, it is a matter of getting drawn here in NM. If not a deer or elk I would like to try it out on hogs in west Texas ( or anywhere a hunt is available). I subscribed to the smaller / faster bullets for years until I killed a deer with a rifled slug in an Ithaca Deer Slayer at just over 130 yards. Dropped him stone dead without him taking over one or two steps. That made me a believer in big chunks of lead thrown at moderate speeds at reasonable distance.


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Way back when, I bought a box of 500 ga. RN bullets to load in the .45-70, just for grins. With guidance from the RCBS loading manual I loaded those little stogies to within 200 fps of what a .458 Win Mag shot the same bullet. It was fun to shoot offhand .......... not so much off the bench. whistle


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Originally Posted by RyanF
I think the big slow bullet observation is true for deer but, maybe not so much for elk. Muzzleloaders have the reputation for not killing elk so good. As do slug guns. A lot of elk have been killed with .45-70's but that monster can kill pretty much anything.

Elk aren't anything special and I've killed them with it. Along with moose, eland, pronghorn, oryx, hartebeast, deer, and more. They don't have to go fast either. The eland and other Africans were shot with a load that did not make 1200 fps. The others only a little bit faster. I have a handful of .45s because they work really, really well.


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SKB probably has the ultimate elk muzzleloader, and it is gigantic. Maybe the builder did that for a reason. A few years ago, I chased an elk a long way and it turned out my buddy had made a good hit with a .50 cal muzzleloader. The pack out sucked, and the meat tasted like shit as a bonus. Literally put a bad taste in my mouth for muzzleloaders. A similar thing happened on the Meat Eater show on Netflicks but he never did recover the thing. I guess it just happens sometimes, but I've never seen it happen with any .308 or .30-06 based cartridge. Happy Thanksgiving!

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Well, I guess I'm still in Roy's camp as I shoot a southpaw Mark V in .300. I need a flat trajectory and good retained enery downrange and it delivers...consistently. The shots can be long at times and I want the animal anchored. I am very-much after the "blue-spark" (because tablefare is the goal) and my silly old "Japanese" and wood-stocked Weatherby simply delivers. It does tend to "maim on one end and kill on the other" but I don't shoot it for pleasure nor do I need to shoot it often. The average is about 3-shots per year ( 2 at the range to confim sighting and 1 to kill). I handload for it and I know what it likes (earned knowledge, for-sure). I set it up about 25-years ago now, primarily for elk but it's quite efficient on deer too (it is a bit hard on the deer however, I prefer a .308 for them).

In Pennsylvania, I'd love to be using my flintlock longrifle, but out here you need to be competent shooting at distences unheard of where I grew up. Different horses for different courses.

Last edited by Lloyd3; 11/24/22 03:26 PM.
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Well....somebody did ask for pictures:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

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[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Had an elk tag as well, but never saw one. Public land hunting gets tougher each year. You simply can't get away from humanity anymore unless you can somehow restrict vehicle access, and even that's no guarantee. Got a consolation-prize doe and was glad for it. Back out again in December to assist another buddy with his elk tag (on a ranching for wildlife unit).

Here's irony for you...this guy lives in my side yard.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Last edited by Lloyd3; 11/28/22 06:00 PM.
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