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Joined: Oct 2006
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Sidelock
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Joe, Thanks for the information. Very interesting that Joe Manton patented someone else's invention!


Rich
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Joe, I have a flintlock era John Manton, later converted to percussion, with the grip safety. I have no way of knowing whether it was installed on the gun when it was made (1809) or when it was later converted to percussion by John Manton & Son. For the reasons mentioned in my earlier post the grip safety would have worked well in a duck blind. I think that my John Manton (8.4 lbs. with strap swivels) likely was used as a duck gun.


Rich
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Later German(Belgian too) version(1910):

[Linked Image from jpgbox.com]

[Linked Image from jpgbox.com]

[Linked Image from jpgbox.com]

[Linked Image from jpgbox.com]

Serbus,

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Originally Posted by RichardBrewster
Joe, I have a flintlock era John Manton, later converted to percussion, with the grip safety. I have no way of knowing whether it was installed on the gun when it was made (1809) or when it was later converted to percussion by John Manton & Son. For the reasons mentioned in my earlier post the grip safety would have worked well in a duck blind. I think that my John Manton (8.4 lbs. with strap swivels) likely was used as a duck gun.

Richard, thinking about it, the grip safety was a pretty good idea. In the time these flinters were made there was only walk up hunting and on a wild flush there isn’t much time to cock the hammers before the birds or hares are out of range, especially with the “ammunition” available. Carrying the gun at full cock and then merely raising it to the shoulder would put a lot of extra game in the bag. So despite the obvious dangers of a grip safety I can understand why they used them. Been there, done it. Today when I have a dog on point I go in for the flush with both hammers full cocked and there isn’t any safety other than me. I do tell my hunting partner “Fire in the hole” when I pull them back.


If we feed our faith our fears will starve, if we feed our fears our faith will starve.
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Joe, I like 'fire in the hole'. My Manton was made for a Philadelphia U.S. buyer c. 1809. I feel confident it was a duck gun, given the weight, the carry strap fittings and the very plentiful waterfowl populations in those days on the Schuylkill River, the Delaware and nearby New Jersey marshes. I think the grip safety was also a great idea for waterfowl hunting where the birds come to you instead of the other way around! It also would have worked well on a river in a float boat where the gunner sat in the bow with the butt resting on the floor of the boat.


Rich
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The grip safety would also have come in handy on a rail shooting boat where the gunner sits in the bow with the butt of his gun resting on the deck of the boat and his left hand on the barrels. The hunter's buddy or hired hand poles the rail boat through the flooded marsh. When the rail flush, there isn't much time for a gun that is not on full cock! I have done this in the wild rice marshes in South Jersey not far from Philadelphia. I would not be surprised if rail boats have been poled through those marshes ever since the flinters and later percussion guns were in use.


Rich
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Richard, mine is a perfect upland gun. It is a true 16 gauge with 30” barrels. Weighs a tad less than 7 pounds and has great stock dimensions. Balances right about where the pin would be if it were a breech loader. MOI is about as good as could be hoped for. To top it off it has killer English walnut. Springs are as strong as day they were made. I often use it to illustrate that the game gun had reached its final form by 1820 and the basics have never changed since. They are always amazed.


If we feed our faith our fears will starve, if we feed our fears our faith will starve.
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What a wonderful gun!


Rich
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https://www.gunbroker.com/item/904211776

This is a great little St. Étienne offering.


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[Linked Image from jpgbox.com]

[Linked Image from jpgbox.com]

[Linked Image from jpgbox.com]


Henri Mangeot Arquebusier à Bruxelles de S.M. le Roi des Pays - Bas


http://littlegun.be/arme%20belge/artisans%20identifies%20ma/a%20mangeot%20gb.htm


Serbus,

Raimey
rse

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