doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Darne 16 gauge

Anybody here shoot a Darne? There’s a 16 gauge, straight stock in reasonable original condition at our local gun show. No rust or pitting, I’d say 50% blue, action gone grey but original stock and checkering is good. Anyway, do you find that sliding breech awkward, or do you get used to it with use?

This gun is very light and handy with 27.5” barrels.

I own two, a 10 gauge (R-10) and a 12 gauge (P-19).The stocks tend to feel short for the measured length of pull. Many of them have way too much drop, but if you can find one with modern dimensions, they are a pleasure to use. Most seem to be relatively light in weight but the action is extremely strong. If you can, check the trigger pulls, as some seem to be very heavy and depending on the model, can be hard to adjust. Most are 2-1/2 inch guns, but that's not a problem if you reload or don't mind paying RST prices.

That sliding breach is a delight: lift the lever and the shells come out of the chambers, then tilt the gun and they drop into your hand.

Prices seem to be all over the map. Depending on grade, you could be talking an $8-900 gun or a $3,500-4,000 (although probably not, with that much wear) gun. You can determine the grade by removing the barrels and looking on the flats. Add 10 to the number of grade markings on the flats (they look sort of like circles).

Be sure you like it before you buy it as they are easier to purchase than to sell.

Ted Schefelbein, who posts here, was the importer for a while and can tell you much more about them. Goeffrey Gournet, the engraver, also works on them, as does J.J. Perodeau, the gunsmith formerly at Champlin Arms.

If you decide to pass on this one and don't mind, I'm looking for a reasonably priced 16 gauge sxs and I'd appreciate the contact information for the seller.

Thanks I’m thinking about offering a straight across trade for my 12 ga LC Smith featherweight that is completely restored, new stock, rust blued barrels and color case hardening. It weighs 6#9.5oz, seems to fit me fine, but I don’t hit well with it and I’m looking for a lighter gun to carry for pheasants.

This Darne has reasonable drop, but you’re right about the length of pull, it’s 14-1/8” feels an inch short to me.

Serial number 11579 under the lever, nothing I can see on the barrel flats, one piece stock.

If you do decide to lengthen the stock, let me recommend using an ebony or other wood extension versus a pad to keep the balance better. On a gun as light as these generally are, 5 or 6 ounces at the butt really makes a difference in balance and handling.

That is alarming, G-John. You should see just ahead of the flats the proof marks from St. Etienne on the barrels themselves. On the flats should be a number of round punch marks which, as noted, are added to 10 to define the grade. You should also see the chamber length in either centimeters or millimeters and a nitro proof mark, usually PT. Key here is to look at the lever. It should have the word "Darne" in elaborate script in a small cartouche Between the ears near the breech when closed. If it does not, it is not a Darne but possibly a licensed copy from another maker.

Regards, Tim

Ok, I’m not looking at the actual barrel flats, I was looking at the action under the breech. It wasn’t obvious how to remove the barrels, so I didn’t get to see under there.

Fellows,
He said “One piece stock”. That is a big hint. It’s old. Better than good chance it isn’t even a Darne. That changes things.
First question should always be, does it say Darne on the opening lever. Yes, or no?
After that is out of the way, we can get to the flats.

Best,
Ted

This forum is the best! I’m going to pass on it.

And the answer is no, it doesn’t say Darne anywhere. Cool gun though. I’ve always been intrigued ever since I read Stephen Bodio’s Good Guns Again

The guns with no name on the opening lever can be fine guns indeed, but, one has to appraise the individual gun. They were often built by outworkers, for a retailer, or a manufacturer, who would catalog and supply sliding breech guns. Most are 1894 patent R models, with brazed barrels, the earlier version that was replaced at the Darne factory by the 1909 R patent gun. The older patent was available for a few years at the Darne factory alongside the new version, but, sold to other builders as a proofed and in-the-white barreled action, out the back door, so to speak, for decades. I’ve not seen a “clone”, unmarked V model, and I doubt they exist, but, it is possible, I suppose.
It is very much easier to buy a Darne, then to sell one. Avoid project Darne guns.

Best,
Ted

Thanks, this one has issues, the biggest being it binds on closing. You can’t just push forward on the lever, you have to close it by using the web of your thumb-hand low to get leverage, feels like you’re going to pinch your hand every time.

That said, what a wonderful gun to hold and shoulder. I was always intrigued after reading about them in Bodio’s book, but never saw one till yesterday.

And, just like that, down the rabbit hole we go....

An R model Darne is locked closed by a rather fearsome main spring, that is pinned into the lower metal, and actually sprung into the opposite bend of what it is when it is at rest. There is a fair amount of resistance getting the little guy closed, always. The opening lever gives you enough mechanical advantage to get that task done. A Charlin sliding breech gun opens and closes without any resistance, assuming the gun hasn’t been fired-if it has, you are cocking the gun on opening, and meet that resistance.

A Darne R model isn’t like that. As you already noted, keep any of your skin out of the closing operation, as it is always painful and bloody if you try to close the gun with your hide in the workings.

I’m going to go out on a limb, and speculate there was nothing wrong with the Darne clone you saw, or, at least nothing wrong with opening and closing, other mentioned issues I haven’t reviewed.

It was just unfamiliar to you.

Best,
Ted

Hope it’s not too late to add in. I acquired a 16ga Halifax Darne today, and it does not have the grade markings mentioned. It has “No 4” on the flats, and. “B” in a circle on the barrel hook. Serial number 31653. Would appreciate others insight. First personal experience with one of these.

B., probably best to start a new line about a new gun. Ted knows Darnes. But, here's my $.02. 31653 is an early Darne....1903-04?

Ted will tell you that this chart is riddled with errors but for the moment it's all we got. By the way..photos really of the proof marks etc really do help.

The Halifax marked guns seem to have a different numbering sequence then the graded monobloc guns referenced in the chart, above. The biggest problem with the chart above is that it was specific to guns sold in France. Exports were numbered differently.
The capital letter B on the guns barrel lug seems to indicate a gun with brazed, non monobloc barrels (tip of the hat to Dustin on that one). The most important clue on this gun is the “No 4” you see on the flats.
The Halifax existed because there were economic times that didn’t allow for people to part with the money for a graded Darne, which, was always an expensive gun. When times were really tough, there were several grades of Halifax gun. Your No 4 was produced in a window from about 1930 to sometime in the late 1930s. A number 4 was the most expensive of the Halifax guns.
A 16 gauge Darne is a pretty sweet spot to be in for a gun you can comfortably carry all day without growing weary of same. It isn’t a high volume clays gun, but, you already knew that. If you search the forum you should be able to come up with tips I posted here about a million times on how to keep your gun healthy, and you happy with using it, otherwise, ask again.

Good hunting. That is what it is for.

Best,
Ted