doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DIY Gunsmithing @ doublegunshop.com Timberlux

A decent box of shells costs at least $10-15 and is gone in a hunt or two. A tank of fuel is 50-$100 and gone after a few hundred miles of driving.

$30 for a finish that lasts several years or even decades, particularly when applied to a gun worth hundreds or thousands of dollars, doesn't seem like a cost worth counting.

The real question is only if it is better or worse than the other finishes available. $3 or $30? Irrelevant in my opinion.

What I'd like to know is what kind of finish is produced and what type of gun or project it would be best for. I'm partial to the traditional English oil finish for vintage double guns. But I'm also interested in learning about other options

Woodreax, I buy in bulk and get the 1/2 oz bottle for $8 it will do 2 stock refinishes. It works great for English style hand rubbed finish. check out the photos and videos on the website. Call me if you have questions or contact Brian at Timberlux.

http://www.timberluxe.com

I disagree completely Woodreaux. I'd like to retire comfortably someday, but accomplishing that means that I shouldn't piss away money on inferior products. If I save a lousy $20.00 on a stock refinishing job, that is money I can use toward the purchase of more ammunition, my next gun, or fuel to fill the tank on my truck. Wasting that amount on an inferior product when better, cheaper products are available is merely proof that P.T Barnum was right about a sucker being born every minute. And it is well known that boiled linseed oil, i.e., refined linseed oil with a dryer added, is at the extreme low end of overall performance as a gun stock finish. It has little water or abrasion resistance. It offers virtually no UV light protection to wood, and it is actually a food source for mold and mildew. The addition of naptha to thin it, and sunflower oil which is more suited for cutting boards and wooden salad bowls adds nothing to that performance. Mike Hunter correctly pointed out that linseed oil in combination with copal and other resins has a long history as a better wood finish than linseed alone. Linseed is a great additive in varnish and oil based paints. But for a gun that is actually used, there are many better finishes available.

The only good thing about Linseed Oil as a wood finish is that it is relatively cheap and readily available. But when someone markets it as something it isn't, and then charges an exorbitant amount for it, to me that is little different that the con artist that sells fake Rolex watches or gold plated jewelry that is stamped 14k

I don't mean to say that I would choose to pay more if all things were equal. Just that I wouldn't dismiss something just because it's more expensive, especially when the difference in cost doesn't contribute significantly to the overall cost of refurbishing or using the gun.

For the amateur (thats me), the extra $20-30 per gun adds up to not very much money over the course of my life. For the professional, I would think that extra cost would be easily recovered in the fee charged to the customer, most of whom wouldn't notice a difference of $30 in the overall refinish of a fine gun, especially if the finish exceeds their expectations.

Now if it's an inferior product, that's a different story.

Look its 25% sunflower oil, 25% linseed oil, 48% Naphtha, and some Japan drier. If you really must have it, you can make a gallon of your own for $30, (.46 cents per oz) or� you can spend $15 an ounce.

Let�s see� 128 oz in a gallon, thirty bucks for two ounces� that�s $1920 a gallon. �.geesh� I�m in the wrong business.

Kinda like spending 15 bucks for a single loaded round, or reload your own for .46 cents. Your call, and your $$$

What if it was a super-duper gun oil for fifteen bucks an ounce, that was a mixture of 25% motor oil, 25% automatic transmission fluid and 50% kerosene� is it still worth $15 an ounce just because it will lubricate your gun? Or would you look for something better and less costly?

There�s a whole bunch of better finishes out there�. Spend twenty bucks on a quart of Daily�s Ship n Shore, give it a try; my solid oak kitchen table is finished with it� it�s had boiling water (teapot) spilled on it, 5 years in use, two teenagers, no water marks, no white when wet, no peeling, my wife wipes it down with a damp sponge 3-4 times a day with no issues. And yes I use it on stocks.

I use the Ship n Shore & teak oil on my boat�s wood� it�s in all types of weather and outdoor conditions: constant sunlight, always wet, and even a bit of fish blood� it holds up great.

When was the last time you exposed your guns to those conditions? Then sprayed them down with bleach and a good hose rinse when you got it home.

I wouldn�t even attempt that with a linseed or sunflower oil finish.

Mike, do you mean that you are using Daily's on guns as well? Granting that it gives a super durable finish, I would have thought a boat finish would not give a finish comparable in appearance to an oil finish. (Edit: I see that you added that you do use it on stocks. Is it your primary finish of choice?)

Your point about making your own finish seems mostly reasonable. My point is that the same argument could be made for Daily's, or just about any other finish: Figure out the ingredients and make your own, and you'll undoubtedly saved some money. At Large volumes, it could be quite a lot of money.

You might say, yes, but it's a real hassle to sort out what the ingredients are exactly, then to get the ingredients in the appropriate form, then to figure out just how to mix them, etc. And it's not worth $15 saved, when I can just go online and order it for $20/qt.

So granting that not everyone wants to make everything from scratch, I still say that $30 is a drop in the bucket when refinishing a fine gun. It's less than the FFL fee to have the gun shipped to a gunsmith.

All that said, I made my own slakum oil and very much enjoy the process. So for me, if Timberluxe is good stuff, I would definitely be inclined to give a go at replicating and then modifying the formula to suit me. It's more enjoyable to me than just buying the bottle off the shelf. But I wouldn't fault someone for skipping that step if they had more money than time and interest.

I could go down to the Piggly Wiggly and buy everything that goes into a Gormet meal but that don't make me a Gormet. I could make my own underwear for pennys on the dollar of store bought but I don't, I could mix my own rust blue solution but I don't. I could load my own shells but I don't . I could heat with wood but I don't. I could mix my own finish and I have and still would if I found a mix that gave better results than Timberluxe.

If you guys are happy with what you use and get good results , good for you. But why the negativity for a product you have never used?

Threads like this have driven the wealth of knowledge that was once here away.

Woodreaux


Yes I use Daily's on guns as well, generally I use Ship n Shore on the inletting, as well as a sealing coat for oil and lacquer type finishes.

Like many others here I've got a bunch of wood finishes that I've tried once.

My go to finishes are Daily's teak oil, Watco Danish oil, believe it or not Minwax Antique Oil finish and Tru-Oil; all depending on the look that I'm trying to achieve.

I can get anything from a had rubbed oil finish to a high gloss "piano" finish with just Tru-Oil, it all depends on how you work it.

There's a lot that I look for in a wood finish; does it protect the wood from moisture, easy to apply and work with, easy to repair, and will it give me the look that I'm after, mostly replicating the original finishes.

I also don't like "gummy" finishes, especially on stocks that will be checkered.

Both linseed oil and sunflower oil are pretty poor in protecting the wood from moisture, and linseed oil is pretty gummy. There are sooo many better options.

Try Timberlux if you like it... great, but keep in mind that it will not do a good job of sealing the wood. But also try some Daily's... it is good stuff, and actually made to protect wood.

There's a huge difference between saving 5 or 10 bucks a quart on making a home brew that has numerous and costlier ingredients, and saving around $1900.00 a gallon on something that is simple and cheap to make.

But I'm not really sure why anyone would wish to make their own homemade version of Timberluxe, because even if you save a lot of money by doing so, it still isn't very good as a stock finish. Nothing in the ingredients is worth anywhere near what it costs. I think Mike's example was simply to illustrate what a terrible buy it is, for an inferior product. He gave the name of a couple products that are much cheaper commercially, and will do a much better job of finishing a gun stock and providing long term protection.

Once I thought it would be cool to grow my own alkanet and make my own alkanet root stain from it. Now I realize that I can get equal or better results buy simply buying some Behlen's Solar Lux. But I sure as hell wouldn't do that if the Behlen's cost over $1900 per gallon, and didn't work as well as alkanet. It isn't just about saving a few bucks. But I've already said that.

Mark asks why the negativity for a product that we've never used. The answer to that is simple, and if he had paid attention, the answer has already been provided numerous times. The ingredients in Timberluxe are not anywhere near the best choice for a gun stock finish, and the cost for what you are actually getting is beyond ridiculous. This isn't about cooking a gourmet meal, and we aren't forgetting secret ingredients like eye of newt and wing of bat, mixed under a full moon. I've painted a number of cars too, and always used good brand name automotive paints, primers, and clearcoats. If someone started selling cheap water based latex house paint and marketing it as a great automotive product at an exorbitant price, I wouldn't have to actually buy it and paint a vehicle with it to know that it wouldn't be a good choice. If using our brains drives non-thinking people away from this site, I'd like to be the first to say goodbye to them. I think that's a pretty lame argument for digging in ones heels and trying to convince guys to pay a lot for linseed oil, sunflower oil, and naptha.

I don't think Mike and I are driving folks or a wealth of knowledge away. We are offering knowledge on wood finishes that is proven and very well established. The one reference book I suggested is hardly the only source of this information, and we're not simply making things up about this subject. My opinions are based upon well known facts. Some folks still swear by Linseed oil for furniture and wood floor finish too, even though there are much better choices. The jury came back and gave their verdict long ago, and Mark is rejecting it. At this point, I wouldn't even try to change his mind.

Daly's has been my principle wood finish for a dozen years or so, great stuff! I also use Watco Danish oil, Linseed oil, alkenet root, Waterlox,spirit stains, all depending upon the finish I desire. I have a client who uses Winwax antique oil finish with superb results. I often use Daly's to harden my Linseed oil finish. It has been 15 years since I used tru-oil but I hunted the last stock I finished with it this year in driving rain and sleet, still good to go. Lots of ways to get a good finish. I have yet to try Timberlux, I admit the price scares me off, but I do like the what I have seen of the stocks finished with it. I might have to try a bottle just to see for myself. Like Mark, I do a lot of restoration work and while resistance to the elements is one factor I consider it is not the only one.

Good to see both Mike and Mark posting on the forum.