March
S M T W T F S
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31
Who's Online Now
8 members (Argo44, LeFusil, Ken Nelson, battle, 2 invisible), 282 guests, and 2 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums10
Topics38,374
Posts544,002
Members14,391
Most Online1,131
Jan 21st, 2024
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26
Boxlock
OP Offline
Boxlock

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26
Just got ANOTHER beautiful 16 ga. drilling. The ad said the rifle was 11.5x65R but when I got the gun, it came with 6 cartridges. Four were R-P 444 Marlin cases, but two were unmarked loaded cases that are 52 mm long and 11.35mm at the neck and 11.8mm at the base. Also with the gun was a piece of paper with handwritten "11.15x52R and 62/78". The 444 case fit in the chamber fine but they are 56.3mm long. My guess is the previous owner (deceased) cut them down and used them as handload for the rifle. While trying to figure out the proof date, I came across what seems to be a second serial number (145812). It looks like the shotgun barrels were lengthened to shoot 3" shell, so maybe the rifle was re bored to 444 Marlin? It's just another one of those Drilling Mysteries. Of course I plan to have my gunsmith do a chamber cast, but wanted to ask you all for your opinions while I wait. Thanks!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/vqzpq5dmzka215n/20191022_152652.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/588cjwe4n5w0k6t/20191022_152557.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xj5dg75hu1zvnac/20191022_153224.jpg?dl=0


Sam Hershfield Bradenton, FL and Hendersonville, NC
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
Drilling Guy,
Your drilling was made after early 1893 when they started proofing them, and before 1912 when they started marking bore(not groove or bullet) diameter in mm instead of the old gauge measurement. The mark 62/78 equates to about 10.67mm or around .4198". This is bore diameter, not bullet diameter. Of course, many were different, but a rule of thumb is to add about .008" to bore diameter. This would result in a bullet diameter of about .428". The use of 444 Marlin cases point to a cartridge in the LK series, and the trimmed length of 52mm points to the 11.15x52 LK Express, but that bullet is listed as 11.2 mm which is larger than that guessed at by the rule of thumb. You should trust the chamber cast and/or barrel slug. There are a couple other possibilities and when you measure the chamber cast and groove diameter, we can look again.
Mike

Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 284
Likes: 25
Sidelock
Offline
Sidelock

Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 284
Likes: 25
Chamber pressure for the 444 Marlin is 42,000. Might be a tad too much for the old action on a regular basis or even once.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,736
Likes: 181
Sidelock
***
Offline
Sidelock
***

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,736
Likes: 181
Looks to be a Sauer product that was retasked or was issued another Sauer serial nummer?

62916 - 1896 circa

145812 - 1908 circa


Cheers,

Raimey
rse

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
Sidelock
**
Offline
Sidelock
**

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,445
Likes: 201
HalfaDouble,
A 444 Marlin cartridge is too long to chamber(56+ vs 52mm) and the rim is too thick. They will only use 444 cases to make the Lancaster brass from, and the resulting cases would be loaded to an appropriate pressure. Your caution is well taken, even though this chamber is too short, others in the LK series are long enough. If you post photos of barrel flats, we might be able to prove or disprove Ellenber's theory.
Mike
.

Last edited by Der Ami; 10/23/19 09:08 AM.
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 284
Likes: 25
Sidelock
Offline
Sidelock

Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 284
Likes: 25
The OP said "The 444 case fit in the chamber fine but they are 56.3mm long" and "maybe the rifle was re bored to 444 Marlin". Just wanted to be safe.

Last edited by HalfaDouble; 10/23/19 11:22 AM.
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26
Boxlock
OP Offline
Boxlock

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26
Thanks Mike


Sam Hershfield Bradenton, FL and Hendersonville, NC
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26
Boxlock
OP Offline
Boxlock

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26
Thanks Sidelock


Sam Hershfield Bradenton, FL and Hendersonville, NC
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26
Boxlock
OP Offline
Boxlock

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26
Always great info Raimey, thanks!


Sam Hershfield Bradenton, FL and Hendersonville, NC
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26
Boxlock
OP Offline
Boxlock

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 26


Sam Hershfield Bradenton, FL and Hendersonville, NC
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Link Copied to Clipboard

doublegunshop.com home | Welcome | Sponsors & Advertisers | DoubleGun Rack | Doublegun Book Rack

Order or request info | Other Useful Information

Updated every minute of everyday!


Copyright (c) 1993 - 2024 doublegunshop.com. All rights reserved. doublegunshop.com - Bloomfield, NY 14469. USA These materials are provided by doublegunshop.com as a service to its customers and may be used for informational purposes only. doublegunshop.com assumes no responsibility for errors or omissions in these materials. THESE MATERIALS ARE PROVIDED "AS IS" WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANT-ABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, OR NON-INFRINGEMENT. doublegunshop.com further does not warrant the accuracy or completeness of the information, text, graphics, links or other items contained within these materials. doublegunshop.com shall not be liable for any special, indirect, incidental, or consequential damages, including without limitation, lost revenues or lost profits, which may result from the use of these materials. doublegunshop.com may make changes to these materials, or to the products described therein, at any time without notice. doublegunshop.com makes no commitment to update the information contained herein. This is a public un-moderated forum participate at your own risk.

Note: The posting of Copyrighted material on this forum is prohibited without prior written consent of the Copyright holder. For specifics on Copyright Law and restrictions refer to: http://www.copyright.gov/laws/ - doublegunshop.com will not monitor nor will they be held liable for copyright violations presented on the BBS which is an open and un-moderated public forum.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.0.33-0+deb9u11+hw1 Page Time: 0.059s Queries: 34 (0.035s) Memory: 0.8473 MB (Peak: 1.8988 MB) Data Comp: Off Server Time: 2024-03-28 17:14:22 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS