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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 390 Likes: 8
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 390 Likes: 8 |
I have always reloaded with AA or Claybuster wads, and Never gave it much mind. When reading about a UK specific guns with recommended use of lead only with fiber wad. I asked myself why only fiber, and does anyone in the U.K. Shot plastic wads? I guess I am a little clueless of why the specific difference.
Maybe, the game keepers don,t want plastic wads laying all over the place. is there that big of a difference on how choke acts with plastic verses fiber.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,739 Likes: 493
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,739 Likes: 493 |
Plastic wads do pattern tighter. Many places just dont want plastic anything left behind. Seems minor to us but they last a long time and enough of them will be seen as trash in the end. Ive picked up countless old plastics empties, over the years but almost no paper shells. Makes sense to only use quickly broken down wads if possible. Ive tried the biodegradable wads but finding them was a bit of a bother. And I always wondered how fast do they break down and under what conditions? Sunlight over several years might technically be biodegradable but in truth, under those limitations, it means they will clutter things up for years. They do if they last like biodegradable targets last.
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,737 Likes: 96
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,737 Likes: 96 |
I think that they will be banned in the U.K. within a few years. Denmark are set to phase them out. Plastic pollution is becoming a real worldwide problem and everyone needs to do their bit. Here we have always had fibre wads available and they are the most popular type. One clay shooting club I go to have never allowed plastic wads in all its time and I have been going there since the early 70's. A lot of U.K. clay grounds are fibre wad only. I only use plastic wads at one ground I go to where they land in a specific area in a quarry type ground and the ground is regularly skimmed to retrieve shot for scrap and the wads are re-cycled. Most game shooters use fibre as far as I know. The main problem is in steel shot ammunition but Gamebore for one are experimenting with a fibre cup wad for steel. No right minded person would leave plastic cartridge cases lying about whether they re-load or not but not everyone thinks about the plastic ejecta that seems to disappear. Paper case cartridges are available from most U.K. dealers but are slightly more expensive. No, it's fibre wads for me and always has been for general sporting use. It is just easier and quicker for manufacturers to load ammo by machine with plastic wads. Lagopus..
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,739 Likes: 493
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,739 Likes: 493 |
Legopus you tend to think in O/U or SxS terms. 90+% of hunters in the US use semi autos or older guys use pumps. Hull ejection into weeds become quickly lost only to show up next year after weathering the elements. So its not all slob behavior by most but Im sure a little of it is. Then sometimes hulls are left for a reason.
Years ago we use to drop paper hulls on the ground when we found zero birds while quail hunting. Even back then, prime locations sometimes had no birds. The hulls were gone in a year. I have heard several others say that they found many of them but never found our secret coveys. Asked a couple if they tried several times and they had. Figured their wasted efforts meant they werent hunting real coveys.
Had one fellow admit he hunted my land often in spite of not having permission and it being posted. Funny thing was he had no clue he was talking to the owner. So I did mention several of the hull dump locations as possible better places to try. Told him the fellow who owned the land he hunted was known to either call the game wardens or just let the air out of a truck tires as a warning to not come back. Not a nice fellow sometimes. That kind of slob hunter, who hunts where he knows hes not welcomed, gets zero breaks with me. Had a couple duck hunters using my blind back in MD last year. Game warden checked them knowing they had no permission. Things went bad for them after that. Had lead shot and a couple funny cigarettes they had been smoking. Dont know what that cost them but it was going to be a lot Im told. Cant fix stupid.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
Years ago we use to drop paper hulls on the ground when we found zero birds while quail hunting. Even back then, prime locations sometimes had no birds. The hulls were gone in a year. I have heard several others say that they found many of them but never found our secret coveys. Asked a couple if they tried several times and they had. Figured their wasted efforts meant they werent hunting real coveys.
Had one fellow admit he hunted my land often in spite of not having permission and it being posted. Funny thing was he had no clue he was talking to the owner. So I did mention several of the hull dump locations as possible better places to try. Told him the fellow who owned the land he hunted was known to either call the game wardens or just let the air out of a truck tires as a warning to not come back. Not a nice fellow sometimes. That kind of slob hunter, who hunts where he knows hes not welcomed, gets zero breaks with me. Had a couple duck hunters using my blind back in MD last year. Game warden checked them knowing they had no permission. Things went bad for them after that. Had lead shot and a couple funny cigarettes they had been smoking. Dont know what that cost them but it was going to be a lot Im told. Cant fix stupid.
"Hulls dumps" and "secret coveys of quail"...I can officially say I've heard it all now. The bird dogs I hunted over would've made quick work of your "secret coveys". Your stOry kinda reminds me of a Mexican my buddy saw running water over a car tire looking for air leaks. Only one small problem the tire wasn't on a rim. You think he was looking for a "secret" air leak ? Now there's something "secret" we can get eYe to eYe on....
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,180 Likes: 1161
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,180 Likes: 1161 |
I'm a landowner, and we shoot my land a lot for doves. I've never been a stickler about guests picking up every hull. Most try to, but when they are left behind inadvertently, I have found that they deteriorate much faster than most think they would. In a couple years of lying in the sun they plastic begins to fade in color and become very brittle, a sure sign of ultraviolet breakdown of the plastic.
I have occasionally found the brass case head of hulls my Grandaddy shot while hunting this land. They are precious to me, and I pause and think that he may have shot into a covey right where I'm standing many years ago. Those were, of course, paper hulls.
I'm not a slob, and I care for my land and try to be a good steward of it for my time here, but I don't get all jacked up over a few hulls or wads that eventually break down due to UV anyway.
JMO, YMMV.
SRH
May God bless America and those who defend her.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,478 Likes: 16
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,478 Likes: 16 |
IME, most Brit guns have barrels and chokes regulated for fiber wad loads. I have loaded fiber (and plastic) for some years and do not notice much difference in their ability to kill birds.
I have loaded a lot of fodder with fiber wads and 'Kwik cert" shot wrappers and like them as well. I am currently loading some fiber wad 2-1/2" roll crimped 12 ga. loads for my Atkin and looking forward to seeing how they perform.
C Man Life is short Quit your job. Turn off the TV. Go outside and play.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,739 Likes: 493
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,739 Likes: 493 |
Joe, you might be as secretive about your favorite turkey spots as we were about their favorite quail spot. That is when we still had quail. I knew fellows who would park with their trucks out of sight so others did not see where they hunted. Fellows tried to protect their go to spots.
The hull dumps were a disinformation just like a fisherman who tells someone he caught all these fish one creek over from where he did. Often you knew who was trying to poach your favorite spots. And quail hunters will tell you that just because your dog does not find quail here today does not mean they are not around. Just smarter than your dog or you. I've seen quail fly a hundred yards out of the wood into a feeding area and then fly directly back. A dog has almost no chance of ever finding that covey. But if they are feeding, when you come along, you can locate them and shoot them. That's just dumb luck and timing. The hull dumps just give people an idea that quail have been here before and might come back so best to check them.
I made the mistake of taking a fellow hunting who I later found out had a nasty habit of returning later, back to the same spots we had hunted. Blood sucking poacher is what I call that fellow. He made the mistake of returning to a farm I did not own but did have permission to hunt. The lady who owned the farm found his truck and cut all four valve stems out of his tires. She often did this to trespassers, even did this once to the Game Warden not in a state vechile. She was a tough old lady who took nothing from anybody. Hard as nails. I doubt he ever hunted on her land again.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,085 Likes: 478
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,085 Likes: 478 |
One reason fibre only wads on some estate shoots in the UK is that plastic wads play hell in ungulates' digestive tracts. The property on these estates often have sheep grazing when there are no shoots. At least that's what I've read... Gil
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