doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Double Rifles, Paradox Guns & Gauge Rifles @ doublegunshop.com I did a bad thing at the Game Fair in London.

Hello the crew.

Well it looks like I own a WW Greener 12 Bore rifle.
I was at the Game Fair in London over the weekend, and a WW Greener 12 Bore rifle followed me home.

Hammer Gun
Damascus Steel Barrels
Recent Birmingham nitro proof
Jones underlever
Fully rifled bores
3 Leaf sight.
12x65 chambers
Antique (Pre 1898 )

Now what?

Anybody got any info ?

I have sent an email to Graham Greener, but gun came with no info.
So bullet weight and style and dram requirements are a mystery.

Should be fun.

Nitro

Love those hammers and firing pins. Interesting system. Enjoy it!

Sorry crappy pictures, rain and overcast. Tent was too dark and outside was wet. Best I could do was balancing an my haunches but it was not steady so very blurry.

Nitro

The weight of the gun along with rate of twist should be a good starting point. Hard to tell from photos but it does not look to be overly heavy. If the twist is slow I would start out with groove diameter RB and a mild charge working up. Best of luck, that is a pretty rifle.
Steve

Better tie a string to your hat when you shoot that one. Nice looking gun though...Geo

No need I shoot big stuff all the time.
(577NE, 12 Bore, 20 Bore, 470NE, Slugs)

Nitro

Very nice, do enjoy!

What a lovely thing. Ideal for mice in the feed store !

Nice gun! Congratulations!

Curious, were you able to bring it back with you because it was an antique?

I would be able to, but I am not coming back soon or directly from the UK.

Nitro

That's a lovely old gun, and an interesting and elegant solution for retracting the strikers.

I wish I could offer you some information on loading and shooting it. But I did recently read some things about loading for the bore rifles in a DGJ article by Ross Seyfreid from the Winter 1999 issue. He said the majority were built for use with round balls and paper cases. He felt it was most important to do a chamber cast to get chamber and throat dimensions, and to check the rate of twist of the rifling to determine the most suitable projectile, and whether it was built for paper or thin brass cases. He seemed to think black powder was the one and only propellant to use in the bore rifles.

Keith,

I will be slugging the bore and casting the chambers and throats as soon as I get back to the US.
I also will be making a new striker for the left side, that one is a poor replacement.
The one on the right is taller and more dome shaped and I believe it to be original.
The one on the left also does not sit concentrically in the cavity, as I said a poor attempt.

The proof house has offered the following information.
Prooved with 740gr Fosbery type slug, Max pressure 740 Bar.

Ofcourse the did not offer any feedback on how it shot or the nominal bore of the slug, and as it was 30% overloaded I would not have expected it to regulate.

Yes lots to do before the adventure can begin.

Nitro

PS: I have all the DGJ's so I will be doing some research through the index's.

She is waiting on export permit at the exporter.



Nitro

Lovely...........

Hi, I came across this discussion (and your �confession�) by chance, and it made me register for this forum.
Congratulations on the rifle. I have about the same (as well as an almost identical by Webley & Son). Yours is however in original condition with the retracting strikers as patented by Greener in 1868 (patent no. 800, March 7.1868) W.W. Greener didn�t like striker springs (nor rebounding locks ..). He described this rifle in �Modern Breechloaders� page 100 and following pages. He suggests an 11-bore round ball or a �hollow point or massive- conical bullet (same as for Paradox).
The right-hand twist of the 11 lands will probably something like 1: 4ft 5, the grooves being approx. 0,08�deep.
You�ll probably find �Sighted with 4 Drams of Powder � on the action. I assume this goes for the 11-bore ball as mentioned by Greener. Castbulletengeneering in Australia can supply you with moulds for both round ball and 12-bore Paradox. Brass must be available in the States. I use 4 dram (7 gram, we�re in France �!) Swiss BP nr 3 (2FG) + some wads and a bit of grease. Shoots well with both round ball and conical HP, but round ball requires quite a bit of crimp to keep it tight on the wads (probably because I use 12-bore ball (round ball .695�).
It will probably be a bit difficult to get provenance from Mr Graham Greener since the books of this period (abt 1868 or slightly later) seem to be lost.
I hope I may contact you in the future for a close-up pic of the hammers for an article I�m writing on these rifles.

Nice find and with a bit of effort it will be even nicer. I would love to find a 12 bore single rifle by one of the better makers.