doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Has anyone heard about this FOX?

The same sort of thing was done with the CSMC over and under Model 21.......it's nothing remotely close to a Winchester Model 21. A joke, for sure and really not much of a surprise that it will be done again.

If the Japanese can 100 percent copy a Parker 30 plus years ago, I'm not sure why someone couldn't copy a Fox Sterlingworth with a snap on Forearm now. Put some decent American Walnut on it as well as options of 30 and 32" barrels and have at it. I truly wonder if the R&D folks at these various companies ever do any historical research before they trot something out. If you are going to call it a Fox then make it truly a Fox. Pretty uncomplicated innards as compared to a Parker.

what he said......

This has been going on for years. After Ithaca bought Lefever Arms Co of Syracuse NY they put on the market the Nitro Special which was absolutely nothing like the original Lefever. They marked it Lefever Arms Co, but with an Ithaca NY address. They were simply utilizing the Name Recognition which they by then owned.

Everyone seems to be doing it. I imagine Savage still owns the Fox name (maybe has some sort of arrangement with CSMC), so--for better or worse--they can call anything they want a Fox. The same way Marlin called sideplated guns made for them by Fausti and Zabala L.C. Smiths. And Webley & Scotts are now being made in Turkey, and don't look that much like W&S either.

Larry do manufactures reach out to writers like yourself and ask for input prior to rolling out something like this. Just seems like this was put together by a couple of Savage folks talking to CSMC and figuring how they could tweak a few things cosmetically and therefore create a new market. The reality is the market is there for a Fox gun that cloned the original in every way except for the possible addition of choke tubes and using steel shot. Just seems like not much research is done before hand, but I could certainly be wrong.

Hey, the PT Cruiser sure isn't a hot rod but lots of people spent their money to buy one and chrome accessories.

tut, you would be surprised at how often it happens exactly as you imagine it. Happens all the time and it's amazing how little market research goes into stuff. Especially in the "licensed" name end of things. I'm not speaking of guns so much as consumer goods like apparel, footwear and sporting gear. I'm guilty of doing it myself on occasion. You get immersed in a market and figure you know it all or all you need to know anyway. One reason I always liked partners. Hard for all of us to drive off the same cliff the same day.

Tut, I didn't have advance warning of this one, for sure! I expect they might have consulted with Michael McIntosh, who was the recognized go-to Fox guy in the gun writing world, were he still alive.

Browning did bring a bunch of us together when they brought out the Cynergy, but that was to put the gun through its paces after it had been designed and the prototypes had been produced but before it hit the market. (We did pick up some minor issues they took care of before they started selling the guns.) At that gathering, several of us tried to sell them on the idea of bringing back the BSS. We felt there was a decent market. They passed. Said that all the people who made sxs for Miroku had retired. And I guess, when you consider all the problems Ruger ran into making a sxs when they brought out the Gold Label, that might have made more sense than we thought it did.

How would every gun maker like to have been in Rugers bind a few years ago. They had so many orders they stopped taking orders when they exceeded a million plus back orders above their yearly production capacity. To catch up they stopped production of the newly redesigned Red Label and several other models to free up production capacity. Though some hoped the Red Label would return insiders knew it was highly unlikely. Shame the 28 ga was a sweet gun.