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Joined: Dec 2001
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,964 Likes: 89 |
The potential barrel qualities of steel were well known in the mid nineteenth century but also a major barrier to its practical use was the inability to produce blanks of suitable quality without internal flaws. In 1869 Sir Joseph Whitworth developed a process of compressing fluid steel into ingots which in effect squeezed out these flaws and resulted in a solid bar. This development began the steady decline and then disappearance of pattern welded barrels. My question is when did the production of Whitworth steel barrels end? I am aware that by the late 1800's considerable competition had begun. Is anyone aware of Whitworth marked barrels after World War 1?
When an old man dies a library burns to the ground. (Old African proverb)
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Joe,
Burrard writing in Volume 1 of," The Modern Shotgun," First published in 1931,states that," Whitworth steel barrels were still in use but meeting increased completion from Vickers and others who had introduced steel barrels of comparable strength and performance."
In the 1980's my friend the late Geoffrey Boothroyd attempted to establish the date that the manufacture of Whitworth barrels ceased. Despite researching the issue with the history section of the Manchester central library, Geoffrey was unable to ascertain the date when production of Whitworth Fluid Compressed steel was discontinued.
Roy Hebbes
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2010
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F Beesley used Whitworth barrels for his best guns up until 1924. There is a note in his ledger marking the fact. Final Whitworth tube numbers noted are 55264 & 55265.
Edit to add that, although these tubes were bought by Beesley in 1924, the guns they were fitted to were not sold to customers until 1928.
Thereafter Beesley used Vickers tubes.
Tim
Last edited by trw999; 05/02/14 04:11 AM.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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I own a sidelock L80 Greener that was made in 1930 and the barrels are marked as being Whitworth.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
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Cockerill-Sambre can probably be blamed for the demise of pattern welded tubes much more than Sir Joseph.
I still don't know the source of 'Armory Steel' which appeared on the Crescent Fire Arms Co. Model 6 hammerless double in 1904, and on the Meriden Fire Arms Co. A.J. Aubrey double in 1905, at a lower cost than Twist or Damascus, but by then the transition from Pattern Welded barrels was in full force.
The Parliamentary Papers, Volume 122, Great Britain Parliament House of Commons reported in 1905 that 1,500,000 rough forged or finished fluid steel barrels were being produced annually by Belgian factories, a large proportion of which was for the U.S. market.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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As an interesting side note, shortly after the turn of the century, Whitworth decided that they would like to make more money on their barrels. So they started to reduce the shipment size to their main customer, LC Smith. After LC got very short on barrels, Whitworth announced a price increase. LC had started looking around and Krupp sent them some fine (better than Whitworth) barrels at a cheaper price. LC used this lever to REDUCE the price they had been paying Whitworth instead of paying more. They continued to use Krupp as an option.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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The potential barrel qualities of steel were well known in the mid nineteenth century but also a major barrier to its practical use was the inability to produce blanks of suitable quality without internal flaws. In 1869 Sir Joseph Whitworth developed a process of compressing fluid steel into ingots which in effect squeezed out these flaws and resulted in a solid bar. This development began the steady decline and then disappearance of pattern welded barrels. My question is when did the production of Whitworth steel barrels end? I am aware that by the late 1800's considerable competition had begun. Is anyone aware of Whitworth marked barrels after World War 1? Joe, I have a 1930 Abercrombie & Fitch catalogue and as of 1930 Purdey, Francotte and others were still advertising Whitworth barrels. As I mentioned earlier, I have a Greener from 1930 that the barrels are marked Whitworth as well.
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 348
Sidelock
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Sidelock
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I have a Ithaca 12 ga. with a magnum frame ordered in 1941 and delivered in 1946 with a set of whitworth barrels.
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,807 Likes: 187 |
 Interesting that this G. Defourny-Sevrin(owner gives Auguste Francotte) sidelock on ShotgunWorld has the phrase "Sir Joseph Whitworth Fluid Pressed Steel": http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=399406Did all Belgian examples with Whitworth have the term "Pressed"? Kind Regards, Raimey rse
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Joined: May 2010
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,529 Likes: 80 |
Seem to recall "Jesopps" fluid steel same process no doubt after the Whitworth patent expired .
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