doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com We'll be in for it now

Double,
You hit the nail on the head "choice", that is the key which we have to safe guard. I'm 60 and like pretty wood and rust blued metal but that is my choice. The Second Ammendment gives us the right to make a choice and I hope that it does not change. We as shooters and hunters once divided by our preferences will soon have few choices to make. This will be when someone else decides for you and I what our choice will be. I doubt that is the path we want to travel.
Best,
Ron

Dubbletrubble,
You certainly could, but isn't that the beauty of the whole thing? My safe has sidelocks, black rifles, elephant guns, revolvers, 1911's and all sorts of shotguns. They all do somethings well and other things not so well. The AR's are accurate, easy to shoot, and good for every critter from prarie dogs to coyotes. My M1A is a match grade rifle that rivals the accuracy of many bolt guns, if I do my part. The SKS in 7.62X39 has been called the updated version of the 30-30(or something close to my paraphrase). To characterize a weapon as good or bad is pretty subjective, don't you think? In my mind, a "bad gun" is one that doesn't work or shoot where it's pointed.
No one has mentioned Armagedden except you. But since you have and if it does come as a battle between "good and evil", do you want your single-shot falling block, or my belt-fed something?
And yes, you and I are both probably self-rightous enough to assume that we'll be on the "good" side in that battle.

Dubbletrubble,

I have a "Black Rifle". In fact I'm getting rid of one and building a new one for coyote hunting. I carried one for 14 years in the service and I'm more comfortable with it than with any other gun. And I can shoot it pretty well. Yeah, there are the Rambo wannabe types out there, but as with any firearm the vast majority are owned and used by regular people who use them in a responsible manner. AR's aren't pretty in the same way that a double is, but if you have an appreciation for a finely machined piece of iron (and aluminum) that will put holes in things at 500 meters with no recoil then you understand what AR owners see in their guns. I think the collectors of German guns understand the AR better than the collectors of Brit guns. Form follows function The new 6.8mm SOCOM round is pretty interesting. It's like one of the new short magnums in .270 only it's not really a magnum. Probably a decent hunting round though.

Interestingly the past firearms bans have been largely based on appearance. No banana clips. No thumbhole stocks, That sort of thing. Nothing to do with actual functionality. The sad thing is that if the antis do get new laws passed they will have very little to do with reality, and would have done nothing to stop the Va Tech lunatic. Crazy bad people do crazy bad things.

Oh and by the way.......you shouldn't make jokes. Armageddon really is just around the corner.......................

Best

Nick

I have a ruger mini 14 and comes in handy when coyotes come sneaking around..I am sure my dogs appreciate it, not to mention the deer that populate my yard (no I do not shoot them)

Gentleman,

The anti-gun crowd will be forming soon enough. I know that we all feel the same on this issue. What I don't understand, is why the powers that be are not asking why people are turning into psycho killers. Why they feel that the only solution to their problems, real or imagined is to shoot up their school or work place?

I have read and heard that this was partially over a girl. What gets into their heads? That is the question.

Don't blame guns. Blame the person. But then, we have to start to take a serious look at these:

The media, with their 24/7 up to the minute saturation of these tragedies.

Violent video games, where when you die, you just hit the reset button and start over. There is even one out now called "Super Columbine Massacre RPG".

Disgusting rap music and videos which glorify thug life, hatred of police, degradation of women, and gun violence.

Hollywood, which glorifies all of the above.

Instead of raising kids, and teaching them right and wrong, medicate them and blame it on some deficit disorder.

We have become a country insensitive to violence. 150 killed in Iraq? No problem, just change the channel to "Antiques Roadshow".

Sorry for the vent, but this is just another tragic incident, and even worse, probably not the last. We really need to look at what I mentioned before they pass yet another useless gun control law that will only pertain to law abiding citizens, and do nothing to stop these events from happening again.

Tell your kids and grandkids that you love them.

Kind regards,

In reply to a discussion on doublegunshop.com regarding those scarey lookin' guns; RE: the massacre in Virginia
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My dear DblTrbl,

The Russian Kalishnikov system is prolly the most reliable firearm in the world. It's looks and military heritage notwithstanding, it is a superb invention that may be adapted to many tasks and calibers. The USA's AR15/M16 action is now used in the finest long range varmint rifles, and can shoot considerably less than sub-half inch groups --- results that competitive benchrest shooters of a decade ago would have paid any money to obtain.

Technology is not static. We don't hunt with Sixteenth Century wheel locks, unless we choose to build them and use them. Nor do we stop to think that a Winchester lever action rifle gave a revolutionary and shocking amount of firepower in it's day. However, the Russian soldiers that frontally stormed the .44-40 Winchester-shooting Turks in some 19th Century set-to, were horrified by their causalities in the face of fast firing repeaters.

Note that the shooting casualties of the War to End all Wars, other than machine guns and artillery, were primarily inflicted with bolt action rifles -- which are the basis for the same well-esteemed custom sporters lining any good gun cabinet.

From the WWTwice era, there are pretty much descended the commercial semi-autos of today sold by the Remingtons, Brownings, Berettas and the rest. The 'functional' argument against MILspec "looking" guns is a stalking horse, at the least.

I have promised myself to dip lightly into BBS's and to skim the least amount with which I may stay informed of my hobbies. BBS's are time-eaters and little is accomplished by engaging in such discussions as this, or "what wood finish would God use?"

However, it's obvious that nearly all casual sportsman and a good many enthusiasts have no, or little, understanding of the world-wide and well-funded antigun movement. There is virtually no planetary opposition it, no money, no staff, no cohesive monitoring of its progress within the European Union's bureaucratic structure, and no reporting to the sportsmen of world of the over 4000 international delegates to the annual conference on civilian disarmament. George Soros and his money has contributed to and fully funds a good deal of this activity, BTW

Nothing which has grabbed the sportsmen's attention severely, where it hurts, is published or being done effectively. Yes, the NRA has trickled this into it's general approach, and the NRA is good at fighting the Aunties. But, we need to WIN this political battle and we are NOT winning. It is an industrial and commercial battle that 95% of the world sees only in profitable terms, in which case the civilian weapon industry is a drop in the bucket -- in return for lucrative mass money trading concessions.

Hardly any government in the world sees the right to self defense and the ownership of civilian arms as being of any merit, period. Let alone, recognizing it as an inalienable right. In short, our Senate and House are mere footnotes in this business. We can place pressure on them, but even that will be at the arbitrary chance of political fortune. As will, incidentally, the Supreme Court ruling on the Second, when that finally does happen.

Now, about those un-aesthetic guns that look scary and cause repugnance among the well-washed. I would advise, that if you have an interest in continued ownership of that lovely blue steel and walnut and case colors in your gun safe -- that you research, most assiduously, the core goals of the antigun orgs. Don't want to? Fine. You do? Fine, too.

Want to take my word for it, because I did my own research? OK: plan on owning no guns at all, just as soon the very well thought out and incremental plans of the gun abolishers come to full fruition. And they will come to pass: there are layers of alternate routes, info and dis-info, and networking with the media to produce a 'shock' word of the month to continue the horror-the horror.

There is all sorts of fundraising, there are large UN funds for the orgs, there are allies such as the absolute genius that runs the Humane Society of America and has PETA under its wing, there's the liaison with the whole spectrum of 'special rights' descended from the Lefty-Marxo popular fronts, and finally a whole buncha scared non-hunting, non-gunowning suburbanites.

Not to speak of a 300 page United Nations paper recently produced by one of Soro's front groups which concluded that "There is no basic right to self-defense." This issue has nada to do with hunting, period. It's just that hunters will be peripherally affected, in that a new hobby will be in their future.

So...when a person decides that 'some' guns are bad, be aware that you are thinking exactly what the Aunties wish you to think. It's called a wedge issue, and it's very effective. I know hunters in my State -- Ohio -- that were appalled when CCW was approved. "Why, why would a person want to do that?" one fellow asked me at an outdoors show, where i was manning a petition table. "Well", I told him,, "so the next time I'm in a store that's being held up, I have a choice about laying down on the floor while hoping that the poor misunderstood felon doesn't blow my brains out, or I can just say "No".

John Meeker, a mere 62 years old,
at the West End of Lake Erie,
Make mine Tens, Chessies and waterfowl, please.

PS: My friend, King, thanks for your kind commentary. I understand the difference in cultures between CANADA and the USA, but believe that we are allies on the cause of human decency and the neccesity for a civil society.

And no Morlocks
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These are just squables within our own shooting sports - when our backs are against the wall - we'll stick together - I'm sure of it!

OK, Zumbo Jr.....

Edit: Seeing your reply below, I'll retract my statement above. It certainly seems like you have an open mind and are willing to listen.

Well this has been a very interesting thread. I can say that I have learned a lot, as I always do here. Ron said it best, it IS about choice. I don't want to see any of us lose our guns ...whatever they be, as we all see them differently and have our own purposes for them. It's true "give them an inch...." and I don't want that. Your right "they " see my old doubles with the same eye as an assault weapon.

That being said, I see all of your points and respect them, this has been enlightening and I thank you. Keep in mind that in the first part of my statement I said I carry every day, another thing I would hate to lose. As another said "crazy bad people will do crazy bad things" and they will always find the means to that end. Gun control or not.

John, it sure is lonely being a gunner. My nephew and I are the only hunters in my immediate and extended family. We were all gunners when I was young. I'm seen as a curmudgeonly throwback in my community, a man with a gun and a black dog. No one is put out by my killing as far as I can tell. I suppose they reckon that the last will soon be gone. There isn't another soul with a gun within five miles of my home, not one on our road. An old man's musing should not be taken seriously but I believe it started with Walt Disney's Dumbo and Bambi and adorable skunks.