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Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 753
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 753 |
are you sure its a muzzleloader? it looks like a hinge pin in the one shot and some slight gap at the breech face. and in those pictures I do not see a ramrod thimble.
a pin fire will have a small notch on the top of the back of the barrels.
any proof marks under the barrels?
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 265
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 265 |
Based on what I see, which isn't enough, I would guess its a pin fire. Looks German or Austrian. Would need more pics.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,791 Likes: 185
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,791 Likes: 185 |
It's not the ignition system that is unique but the breeching mechanism. I'm going to say Bohemian origin but probably Belgian sourced from the 1870s. Yeah, let's see the marks.
Kind Regards,
Raimey
rse
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 445 Likes: 47
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 445 Likes: 47 |
From what I can see it is probably a pin fire. A good close up photo the top of the breech end of the barrels would answer the question.
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,534 Likes: 169
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,534 Likes: 169 |
Last edited by skeettx; 08/17/12 09:33 PM.
USAF RET 1971-95 ![[Linked Image from jpgbox.com]](http://www.jpgbox.com/jpg/57865_80x60.jpg)
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,791 Likes: 185
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,791 Likes: 185 |
That was a common method of opening for a time but it seems that it is blended with the rest and considering the contraption forward of the action, I would say not.
Kind Regards,
Raimey
rse
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 392
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 392 |
I think you pull down the hook thingies and the bbl's will slide forward to open the breech. I could be wrong I often am
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,423 Likes: 314
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,423 Likes: 314 |
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
From the link Drew posted, John Lyell of Aberdeen was active in 1878. William Harvey was granted patent 1056 on April 26, 1860.   This gun appears to be a variation on the Harvey patent. Pete
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 268
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 268 |
Nothing to input, but I am just amazed at the information You fellows come up with. Wow!
Sam Ogle, Lincoln, NE
Sam Ogle
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,534 Likes: 169
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,534 Likes: 169 |
Sweet!!
The upper curl is the lock and the lower curl is the lever
That is a super picture
WOW!!
Thanks
Mike
USAF RET 1971-95
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,463 Likes: 207
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 4,463 Likes: 207 |
This looks like one for Axel's buddy,Shotgun Charlie,to sort out.
Mike
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,791 Likes: 185
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,791 Likes: 185 |
Ah, I think PeteM is hot on the trail getting back to our old friend W.J.(Charles?) Harvey. Looks like W.J. worked in tandem with an E. Brooks under patent No. 950/1862?
Kind Regards,
Raimey
rse
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
E. Brooks shows 2 patents, both for sliding breech:
1863 1585
1866 2196
I can not find 1862 950, sorry.
C. Brooks had 21 patents. I did not check them all.
Unfortunately my source is very abbreviated and usually does not show co-holders or a place of residence.
Pete
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,791 Likes: 185
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,791 Likes: 185 |
I haven't located it either but I wish I had an image of Henry Jones #950 of 1861. I wonder if E. Brooks was Edgar Brooks, sword maker?   Kind Regards, Raimey rse
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Joined: Nov 2005
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
 Pete
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
if someone can provide an estimated value that would be great
$800 to $1200 depending on the bore condition....if they are pitted the value would be less.
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,964 Likes: 89
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,964 Likes: 89 |
And not a word has been spoken about the engraving! Absolutely incredible work. Enlarge it on your screen if you can see the detail and precise execution. this guy was good!
When an old man dies a library burns to the ground. (Old African proverb)
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,859
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,859 |
I thought the carved stock in lieu of checkering was a very nice touch. I wish I had the patience, skill, and tools to do that.
Steve
Approach life like you do a yellow light - RUN IT! (Gail T.)
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 285
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 285 |
The gun looks rather similar to this one by John Lyell which turned up at the Vintagers day at my shooting ground a couple of months ago . Does yours have holes in the hammers, which engage with the pin to act as extractors?    John
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