doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com 10ga vs 12

Crow Shooter;
In total agreement here basically. Any time two shotguns of differing gauges are compared the edge will always be with the one with the biggest hole down the barrel. This applies equally, in fact even more so, to the question of a 28 versus a 20, the advantage will always be to the 20. Since we are speaking of a classic old G grade Damascus Lefever I too sincerely hope he has decided to acquire it. However for the loads he should push out of this gun he should not expect it to magically give him any performance which could not be equalled with a slightly more modern 12ga using similar shot charges.
In fact any of the 3" 12ga guns which were built post the 1920s era for the new "Magnum" loads would out-perform any load which "Should" be fired from this gun.
It is a very desirable gun & could be most useful, it just won't "Walk on the Water", Cause the Blind to See", etc, etc.

Thanks for all the input! Based on all the pros and cons posted here, I decided to go for it. Got a great deal on it too. The gun appears solid in every way with no issues that I can discern. Nice patina overall with great color on the barrels, no dents or cracks. Weighs about 8.5lbs. The gun came from Sweden, but luckily escaped the swing swivel fairy. You can see it here:

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_info.p...13a97f0a942e053

Damn, Mark. That's a deal. They don't call you Uncle Dan Fan for naught. Gil

You're gonna love it. And loading the short 10 is very satisfying. You'll get better patterns because of the shorter shot column height meaning less shot deformation. The big bore always wins out. Only wish my Parker lifter with 2 5/8" chambers was a pound lighter. Paul

Mark;
Don't know how you could have passed on that one.
It appears this is a two-hook model with plate mounted sears. I am going to assume he put an extra X in the SN & it is 18,78x rather than 187,8xx as stated. Lefever SNs didn't reach 100,000 by close to 30,000.
The 10ga is a good solid shooting gun, just don't expect wild miracles of pattern improvement. That vast difference of column height, if loaded with 1�oz in both gauges the column will be just about exactly shorter in the 10 by the dia of one #7 shot (.100").

Miller,

I'm going into it with eyes wide open and no presuppositions. I've been wanting a clean, original, affordable 32" G grade heavy duck gun to go with my H grade 16 upland gun, and I just couldn't pass it up as you mentioned. Clean, affordable 32" G's seem as rare as hen's teeth. Even so, if it was a 12, I would have gone for it as well. I noticed the plate mounted sears also, but how can you tell if it's a two hook? All I've ever seen are single hook guns. The serial # puts it in the 1893 range +/-, which is the earliest Lefever I've owned so far.

I like the fact that a 10 is a bit different, and as capable a gun as any sane person needs. It will be fun to be laying in my little layout boat, ready to defend myself from the evil attacking ducks with as classic a duck gun as there is. And if I finally go on that guided goose hunt of my dreams, I'll be ready

Mark;
My "Guess" was solely on the presumed SN being in the 18k range. The small hook did not seem to generally come into use until in the mid 20K range. An occasional lower numbered gun will be found with either a small or large hook. These are generally assumbed to be frames that for some reason stayed in stock & when finally built were given the latest style action, or else they were sent back to the factory for an up-grade so any type action is possibe, but odds are with that SN it will be a two-hook.
It sure sounds like it has found a good home, I am Happy for both you & the Lefever, enjoy it to the fullest.
Also far & away the vast majority of Lefevers with plate mounted sears will be two hook (or earlier) guns. The G however was not offered in the pivot lever guns as far as I am aware of. It also appears to have the frame cross pin about where the sculpting starts, which pretty well limits it to either a two or small hook gun, this pin not being used on the large hook guns.

"It also appears to have the frame cross pin about where the sculpting starts, which pretty well limits it to either a two or small hook gun, this pin not being used on the large hook guns".

Pieper is correct, the "frame cross pin" (or joint check pin) feature; which was designed to limit downward movement of the barrels when the gun was opened, was eliminated when LeFever placed their large cocking hook feature into production; therefore the joint check pin visible at the upper edge of the frame side radius cut should indicate this gun to have either Lefever's small cocking hook, or double cocking hooks feature. But I use the word should because there are always exceptions with Lefever guns; and I once owned one of those exceptions. This gun was a very light weight 12-bore G grade extractor with a serial number of 18999(?). Perhaps this was an early numbered frame used later in production; but when originally machined it was fitted with the joint check pin feature. On that gun the portion of the joint check pin visible inside the lug cut had been removed to accommodate Lefever's large cocking hook. Wish I still had that gun.

Topgun;
I think that several guns have surfaced with the large hook but with the cross pin cut out as you describe. Its function as the check hook was actually eliminated with introduction of the small hook gun but it was retained & served to cam the extractors on the small hook guns. AS LAC did offer to upgrade to the later actions when one surfaces such as this it is really near impossible to say if it was built that way or upgraded. Either way it is most likely "Factory".
On the single hook guns the lug pin reaching the end of the slot in the hook serves as a very efficient check. Be interesting to see which Mark's is.

A wonderful thread with lots of intelligent input, and it looks like a great gun to hunt kamakazie ducks or geese
with.
Among the many shotguns I should not have sold, was an LC Smith 10 Gauge with hammers and massive damascus barrels. The barrels alone weighed 8 pounds. It was a monster. I shot 50 skeet with it one night just for the heck of it, and if I hit 'em, they were gone. What fun!
Have a ball with it!
Sam Ogle, Lincoln, NE