doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com help me I think I am stupid

In the thirties Winchester developed a choke for the first barrel of skeet that was shaped like an hour glass. So it would contstrict and then get wider. It was designed to spread the shot on the first barrel. It was designed for cartridges made with fiber wads and no shot cup.

In regard to the "13" stamped on your barrel flat there is a chart that gives the bore diameter range for "13". I don't have it.

Best,

Mike

I believe that the gun was made in 1887 or earlier by the proof mark noted. In that era, I think 13 meant .719 nominal bore diameter.

If someone knows differently, please speak. The 14 notates the choke diameter according to what I've read, but I've never had a gun actually measure out to support that claim I found in old literature.

Respectfully, no it is not. You are making the assumption that the bore is concentric. This does not have to be the case. Obtain the proper tools for the job. Measure the wall thickness at the same distance from the breech, working around the barrel and you can often see the wall vary.


This is excellent advice. The proper tool for the job. I will add that once you purchase the tool, discard the dial caliper and purchase a digital caliper as a replacement. It makes life much simpler. Thanks to james-l for that one! You can find one for $30-$40.


I have to disagree with you here Chuck. You are assuming a single manufacturing process was used in all places at all times. We both know this is not the case.

Longitudinally welded barrels were very commonly used. At first this was a hand process. Later a mechanized process was used.

It is also not the case for damascus barrels. They were all created using a mandrel. At least in western Europe. The chemise was predominately Belgian, but not singular to them.

Pete

Of course you are right. I completely forgot damascus and other barrels made in the day.

The Winchester Skeet chokes developed in the 1930's, and found on the Model 21, Model 12 and the Model 42 shotguns- were cut with a 17 foot radius- the conventional chokes were cut with a 13 foor radius- hence the "Bell shape" or ogive-- I have a 1938 Model 12 field grade 28 gauge with 28" solid rib barrel and it is marked WS-2 on the barrel--maybe a special order, maybe a factory Fubar, I don't know--

This might explain some of the fluid steel barrel failures that we've saw that appear to have cracked open in a straight line ?

I believe that most of the bbls with a longitudinally welded seams were made of wrought iron, not steel. This practise remained in use longer for the heavier walled rifle bbls than for shotgun bbls. These bbls of wrought iron required a wall of enough thickness that building a practical double gun for "Shooting Flying was a virtual impossibility until better bbl construction came along, in the form of the "Twist" bbl.

Those steel bbls which have failed with a long crack are generraly presumbed to be from a flaw in the steel. This is something which doesn't occur often but has happened. The problem comes from a air bubble or slag in the ingot, which upon being rolled into a bar is stretched out into a long narrow seam. This seam then has to be in the bar in such location that it falls entirely within the wall of the bbls, thus undetected in the making. This explains why it occurs so seldom, most steel bars with seams were cut into in the process of making or were in the part bored out. Only those which fell entirely within the walls, & also managed to pass proof, remained to present a problem later on.

I agree with the idea that at minimum use the inexpensive Brownell wall gauge. It is imperfect, but can provide a good working answer. I agree with Chuck's recomendation to increase the tension a bit. I changed out the dial gauge for a digital dwell gauge from Harbor Freight that makes reading the thickness much easier and was inexpensive to boot.

As to the wall gauge, like the man says: "the savings from the first gun you pass on buying because of the gauge will more than pay for the cost of the gauge".

A good option to the Brownells gauge is the Truth Tool made by Jonathan Poole. He can be reached at info@SanDiegoGuns.com. the tool's around $200 but comes with a digital gauge. It is made for use outside the shop.