doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Lead shot increasingly under fire

After about ten seconds in the swamp with Pogo, it has a lead oxide shell and IS by most measurements chemically inert.

jack

j0e, land first and guns and ammo second.
There maybe a few ozs of lead down by the lake and a couple of 22 slugs stuck in trees put by me, but otherwise I think I could eat the dirt. Good land is harder to come-by, than good guns these days.

Bouvier

There is a real difference between the amount of lead one hunter will shoot and that that a gun club will shoot over a year, five years or ten years time. A decent gun club will drop tons of shot each year. I doubt that I have shot a ton of shot in my lifetime hunting. I think that your response to the situation was very reasonable and wish more would use good, common sense, like you have.

I refuse to call Democrats commies or socialist. If I were trying to be funny I could say that was because I respected the commies or socialist. Truth is that many family or freinds grew up as Democrats and feel that they have no place to go now that the party has moved away from them and their views. There is no place in the Democrat party for a Conservative, God fearing, gun toting, sane, normal, hard working person. If you can not claim that atleast three of the above do not apply you can not be in the modern Democratic party. You need to be a victom, whiney or stubron as hell to stay a Democrat these days if you are most or all of the above.

The Republican party is almost as bad, just the reverse side of the same coin. I vote each election because I think that if you do not vote you have no right to BITCH. Many times I have to hold my nose and vote for the slightly lesser of two evils.

Lead levels may not all be coming from the gun club. Like Iron and Calcium, Lead can be from natural sources. I have one farm with such high Sulfer and Iron levels that well water is not fit to drink. Safe but not fit to drink. Others have extreme rust or iron problems, nirtires or other metals in the water. Looked at a ranch one time out west and was told that lead levels and some other heavy metal was in the water in high levels. I suspect it had been a reclaimed mine site perhaps. Passed on that land and bought more closer to home.

Gentlemen,
We could debate this issue for ever and a day, but unless we become rational, and more important, united we will have to accept restrictions and the banning of lead shot, which in turn will lead to people giving up shooting and finding alternative pastimes.America is the largest participant country in shooting sports in the World.With I believe one of the best representative organisations (NRA).What we need to do is to unite in the fight to keep our sport and mobilise the organisations to dig in and stand up for what is rightfully ours.You were the first country to roll over and give in to the greenies, and I have NEVER seen scientific evidence that proves that waterfowl have benefitted solely from the banning of leadshot.I saw plenty of evidence to get it banned and we didn't contest it.Here in the UK the largest participant sport is Angling and the anglers have never united to protest against the greenies, but mark my words, it will not be too long before they come under threat.Here in the UK we have banned hunting with dogs, which as resulted in our Rural roads being littered with the corpses of foxes,badgers,boar and deer as the result of vehicle collisions, sometimes resulting in the loss of human life.Perhaps a conservation slogan could be 'Kill your Daughter to save her running over a Fox'
I learned last week that 1 in 10 native Britains are emigrating because of the state of this country. (FACT)

Salopian - Tell your countrymen(women) if they wish to come here the easiest way is to sneak under the wire.

Other than non-tox for waterfowl, we've been able to hunt and shoot at our own pace. No marchers at our gates.
The high deer population has turned the garden set into believers. The geese mess-up the corporate sidewalks. Giving-up lead for fowl has calmed the beast, perhaps!
A record number of hunters, and kills is a good sign of the health of hunting in my state.

Ky Jon .... For the record there have been no lead mines in this area or industry that discharged lead in it's waste in recorded history. For the record, I am a God fearing, gun toating Democrat as were my father and grandfather .... Our family has served the country during all generations loosing our loved ones in every major conflict this country faced. I am happy to say that none of us are one issue voters.

I do not believe that the elimination of lead shot will deminish my ability to own and shoot my guns. The elimination of lead additives in gas did not deminish the number of cars. It's a fact that when something is taken off the market lot's of things surge in to take their place. At the moment alternatives to lead are expensive but if lead were eliminated it wouldn't take long for the market place to find a way to sell the replacements at prices that will let us all be able to shoot as much as we like.

I would be willing to bet that within a year of a lead shot ban you will be able to buy as much non lead as you want at Wal Mart .....

Al

Setting all the emotion aside; as I recall the only remotely scientific evidence that was ever published tying lead to waterfowl mortality had to do specifically with Mallards [only Mallards] ingesting corn when lead shot was present in their gizzards. Its been a long while since I was looking into all of that, but that was the the only ref that I EVER saw or was aware of that made any remotely scientific connective link. I remember opening the gizzards of some several hundred assorted ducks taken in N. TX over several seasons. I found 67 that had lead pellets in their gizzards. All were healthy when taken and in full flight and were subsequently retreived to bag, cleaned and consumed. One must remember that one does NOT become 'mad as a hatter' by rolling a few drops of Mercury around in their hand from a broken thermometer. In today's world of misinformed & idiots, an emergency response TEAM is needed to even begin to fathom the evil from such an incident. Misinformation has always been around, but it travels faster today and is given more weight when it is repeated by pretty people and given even further creedence through tort law decisions.

edit: Please, this is not meant to call any participants here idiots, nor is in intended to deny that lead & a number of other elements can cause certain types of poisoning if absorbed [that being the more appropriete term, since there is a distinct dif between consumption and absorbsion] in sufficient quantity. This issue is primarily one of objectivity getting in the way of the objective .. and it ain't remotely about saving wildlife, just as the legislation that created the EPA wasn't about protecting the environment. Grow up, people.

Nonetheless, there is good that comes from dialogue and discussion and from honest research and discovery. Its the classic insitu of, " .. whose ox is being gored?"

Me? I'm making another contribution directly to the NRA-ILA. The waterfowl issue is a dead duck here already, sanity sat aside and let it happen. Lets not stay the same path for upland game.

It is tiresome to have to read the same mindless generalizations about Democrats, Libs, Lefties, etc. that Ky. Jon, Tanky and others have written. Leave off with the ad hominem attacks. They advance nothing except rancor.
Will

tw, very well said.It is a pleasure to read a well balanced point of view.
May I take this opportunity to apologise to any one I may have offended in my previous rant.But I do get emotional when I can see my love of hunting being threatened by well meaning but misinformed people.
It is now the season of good will to all, so may I say "A very happy Christmas to you all, and may your families and loved ones be protected, a prosperous,happy & healthy New Year to one and all of you.Salopian