doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Thomas Kilby-Donn-Daly damascus side by side

I'm late jumping in on this thread. As others have stated, several other American makers were using Lindner-sourced boxlocks as the basis for their guns. It some cases, like the first Donn gun Jeff used to own, there are no Lindner-marks on the gun though the details of the gun all shout Lindner. As Jeff points out the numbering sequence of the barrel numbers (as well as the gun's serial number in many cases) is consistent across multiple makers/retailers using Lindner-sourced guns. I am away from my reference materials but I can provide several examples that would link the serial numbers amognst these guns. But to why some guns have the Lindner marks and others don't? I'm not sure. I have some thoughts but I will leave that to another thread.

The German/Prussian connection appears to have been a very strong one as I noticed a curious similarity in the last names of many of the makers/retailers who sold Lindner-marked guns - Schaefer, Schmidt, Jakob, Daly, etc., etc. I do want to add while in most cases it appears that Lindner did nearly all the work and the retailer just put his name on the gun (i.e., Charles Daly), in several other cases (e.g., Donn, Schaefer, etc.), Lindner appears to have merely provided the guns in the white and the guns were stocked and finished here in the States. A close examiniation of these guns reveals real gun maker work that goes well beyond merely stamping one's name on the rib. Often the level of workmanship is just stunning.

I knew I should have bought that Donn when I had the chance :-).

Ken

Daly 1680

Michael...Linder 1680 and Donn 941 appears to have been engraved by the same hand. Ok I will say that it WAS engraved by the same hand. The game scenes are the SAME and I don't mean just sort of! Interesting to me that the ribs on the two guns noted above appear to have been checkered ala Bill Wise Matsuka (sp) gun...and that both guns (941 & 1680) have German features (Greener cross bolt & side clips)Features not generally seen on English boxlocks. Could it be that Kilby was having actions sourced in Germany for a period of time and he just the German makers HIS (Kilby) bbls to be fitted to the actions? I think that this may have been the case. It would be interesting to find out more about Kilby and his method of operation. As it s, it appears that Kilby was a custom maker for a descriminating clientle. Guten Tag. Jeff S.

Jeff, from now on we will refer to this engraving as "Duck Butt" which I thought was a bit unusual. Now everyone can check their Dalys for DB and we can see the range (years) that this shows up.

This is a all interesting and goes to show us how much we don't know. I hope John, the person who ask the original question, is not too confused by all this.

Mike, that's a good find. Duck Butt, well I don't know. Also don't know about , what looks like an English Setter, hunting ducks. Hmmmmmm do they do that ?

Daryl, I just don't remember ever seeing a feeding duck depicted in engraving. I'll have to expand my horizons ;-).

Mike, I think that the Duck Butt is proof that many guns were engraved by committee. The guy who was only good enough to do the butts, probably was hoping to do some rocks and grass in the near future. I think a thread on odd engraving subjects might be very interesting.

Michael and all, of course I am becoming confused but also happy about the information. After all the dust settles maybe Michael or some else might explain to this novice about Linder, Daly and others and summerize to the best of your knowledge what you think the origin of my T, Kilby is, a Donn, a Daly or a Linder.

I am delighted to find such a knowledge base.

Thanks to all,

John Grimm

John,
I don’t know what or how much work William Donn was doing by the time he moved to Chicago. I believe that Thomas Kilby supplied the barreled action, in the white which was then sent to Germany (Prussia) where the action was refined and then engraved by someone who also did the Lindners that we know today as “Prussia Charles Dalys”. H.A. Linder was a maker in Suhl, Germany who made gun for SD&G under the name Charles Daly. I have no idea at this time who stocked it, did the carving or the final case hardening and blueing. We need to find a lot more hammerless guns with the Donn name on them before we can get a better idea of who did what.

I doubt if any of the small makers in Suhl had in-house engravers and I suspect that many were outsourced. In my experience with engravers I find that they tend to do the same pattern over and over. Now that more people are aware more stuff might come to light.

More Pictures of John's gun.