doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Self-opening sidelock Defourney....

OWD:
Any chance of a better pic of the flats with the Czech import mark on the underside of the right tube next to the "50??" as well as a pic of the side of the frame? Jaroslav Holecek, like many other Czech gunmakers, looks to have concentrated on machine guns post WWII but still was able to span the full range of gunmaking in offering, possibly just importing, double guns.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

I'll get some more pics this weekend.

OWD

OWD, I want to see the weight of the barrels on the flat of the water table, it is allways indicated with Belgian made guns.
OWD, Defourney made some self opening double guns based on the Beesley action, there is now one for sale in the next Gavin gardiner auction Lot 244. Here is the link:http://www.gavingardiner.com/BidCat/detail.asp?SaleRef=0009&LotRef=244
Because it is a 2 barrels set, cant you tell is the barrels have the same S.N. and are they prooved the same time. Pete is right about the proof controller and date (1950)
Marc.

It may be unreasonable but I would like to think that this BBS could use the proper terminology. I may be wrong about this but IIRC the accepted term is "assisted opening". A self opening gun might be inconvenient.

I have no idea where the ridiculous use of the term "water table" in reference to guns came from, but the REAL term is "action flats". Remember - the face that meets with the Barrel Flats?

I can ignore the atrocious grammar and vocabulary but I mean ...... you should know what the pieces are called anyway.

HTH

WtS

Wonko the Sane, Sir, I suggest you research the terms you refer to especially "water table" and "action flats". I can't remember the sources but check with Michael Mcintosh and other texts that get to the heart of the matter in giving terms of the trade. Even Wiki.answers or answers.com has an definition:

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_a_Water_table_on_a_shotgun_and_where_is_it_located

"Answer: 'Water table' refers to a pan of the action of a double-barreled side-by
- side shotgun. It is the flat portion extending forward from the breech face. This part is also sometimes referred to in a more general way as the action bar flats" - American Rifleman, Issue 9, Volume 114(1966) at page 98

So if one wants to speak generally, "action bar flats" will do.


English isn't the only language. Others use this board to practice or better their English and I think we should allow them a little slack instead of forcing them not to post because of incorrect grammar or using terms you deem incorrect. And if you are looking to critique someone's grammer, choose a fella whose primary language is English, the King's English or of the U.S. of A.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Couldn't agree more, Raimey. Now, if someone uses caplocks or ends a sentence with a preposition, that steams me up.

Something which we should not up with put, to quote Mr. Churchill.

Seems if we want to improve gun terminology, then we ought to work on those terms which are really confusing, or self-contradictory. "False sideplates" . . . the plates are REAL, not false. It's just that the gun isn't a sidelock. "Handling marks" . . . how about MIShandling marks?

You guys have very distorted picture of living under commie. No, of cause, it wasn't good, but there were a lot of people and not high ranking commie who could let themselfs to buy Purdey's and Holland's. I don't talk about Belgian best guns or others that were much cheaper, than English guns in commie countries at the time. But there were allways several best guns in shops in big cities and usually for the price of Russian car such as Volga or Lada.
I was young, but I still remember it.

It takes a real stretch to include ESL folks in a comment that obviously was not directed at them. As ratty as my Russian and Spanish is I am not one to criticize on that account.

I find no ref to watertables in any of my old gunsmithing books - Brit and American alike. Actions flats is in common use tho. And as for taking The Rifleman as a credible source (that's really funny) - all I can say is good luck with using the fount of old wives' shooting tales.

JMO of course


WtS

Here's a few for starters....

1906 Sears

1914 Fox

McIntosh

There are more....

Pete