|
S |
M |
T |
W |
T |
F |
S |
|
|
1
|
2
|
3
|
4
|
5
|
6
|
|
7
|
8
|
9
|
10
|
11
|
12
|
13
|
|
14
|
15
|
16
|
17
|
18
|
19
|
20
|
|
21
|
22
|
23
|
24
|
25
|
26
|
27
|
|
28
|
29
|
30
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums10
Topics38,481
Posts545,233
Members14,410
| |
Most Online1,335
Apr 27th, 2024
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13
Boxlock
|
OP
Boxlock
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13 |
Gentlemen; Here are the proof marks on the underside of the barrel. can anyone translate these into English for me? What do I have here? 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,271 Likes: 202
Sidelock
|
|
Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,271 Likes: 202 |
Mossy, can you give a picture of the flats of the barrels showing what is there ? Your pictures are quite good. Are you sure your gun is a 10 ga. ? Daryl
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13
Boxlock
|
|
OP
Boxlock
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13 |
Daryl, I am positive it is a 10 bore. 10 gauge snaps caps drop into the chambers, and the muzzle end of the bore measures .758". If my math is correct, that should be pretty close to a Modified choke, right? The "12" markings on the barrels threw me as well. The markings you see above are the only markings on the underside of the barrel, with these being the only markings on top: 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
|
|
Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
Pete is that a wire twist ?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
|
|
Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
The rib on the Rival says "Laminated Steel" and looks no different than the Laminated on my 44XL.  Wire Twist and Laminated Steel would have the same meaning. Both are ways of saying a twisted billet that is forge welded. It is curious that the marks on the Rival appear British. Which raises many questions in my mind. Pete
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13
Boxlock
|
|
OP
Boxlock
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13 |
So, does the "12" signify the amount of pressure for which the barrels are proofed?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,271 Likes: 202
Sidelock
|
|
Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,271 Likes: 202 |
Mossy, I see the Birmingham Black Powder proof, Birmingham inspection mark, the S for Servicable, and I think I see SP, but am not sure what that is. One question on the 12. Can you measure the bores ? Every once in a while, one sees guns with a chamber larger than usually associated with the bore. If not a 12 ga bore, I don't know what the 12 is. Maybe some better on proofmarks than I can tell.
I believe your gun was made in England, probably Birmingham and probably with imported tubes from Belgium, but we can not be sure of that. It was exported to the US sometime after 1868 and before 1904. Does it have chokes ? If so, to have the marks proper, the gun would be pre 1875.
I assume there are no marks on the receiver flats. Can you take off a lockplate and see if there are marks on the inside ?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13
Boxlock
|
|
OP
Boxlock
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13 |
Mossy, I see the Birmingham Black Powder proof, Birmingham inspection mark, the S for Servicable, and I think I see SP, but am not sure what that is. One question on the 12. Can you measure the bores ? Every once in a while, one sees guns with a chamber larger than usually associated with the bore. If not a 12 ga bore, I don't know what the 12 is. Maybe some better on proofmarks than I can tell.
I believe your gun was made in England, probably Birmingham and probably with imported tubes from Belgium, but we can not be sure of that. It was exported to the US sometime after 1868 and before 1904. Does it have chokes ? If so, to have the marks proper, the gun would be pre 1875.
I assume there are no marks on the receiver flats. Can you take off a lockplate and see if there are marks on the inside ? The muzzle end of the bores measure .758" with my calipers. I will take a look at the reciever flats and under the lockplates. I had the locks out and was amazed at how clean they were. It's like this thing just stepped out of a time machine!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,544
Sidelock
|
|
Sidelock
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,544 |
That gun was prooved in the UK as a12-bore. If it accepts a 10-bore cartrige now it could have been enlarged subsequent to these proof marks being stamped.
Alternatively it could have chambers cut for a particular cartridge. Measuring the bores at 9" from the breech end should provide some useful data in this regard.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13
Boxlock
|
|
OP
Boxlock
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 13 |
That gun was prooved in the UK as a12-bore. If it accepts a 10-bore cartrige now it could have been enlarged subsequent to these proof marks being stamped.
Alternatively it could have chambers cut for a particular cartridge. Measuring the bores at 9" from the breech end should provide some useful data in this regard. I will need to take it to a specialist for that measurement. I don't have the tools on hand to do that.
|
|
|
|
|
