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Forums10
Topics38,536
Posts545,984
Members14,420
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Most Online1,344
Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,292
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,292 |
Jon:
ya, that's like shipping a "loaded" gun.....real smart...of course, it wasn't their fault...ha !!
Doug
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 1,755 Likes: 30
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 1,755 Likes: 30 |
PA24
Some people are idiots when it comes to shipping. I bought a PW hydraulic unit for a shooting buddy and the seller shipped it without draining the fluid out of it. A pint plus of oil sure makes a mess. Seller said it was UPS's fault as he drew arrows pointing to the top side and they should not have laid the box of its side or top. Lucky they delivered the box at all.
One seller shipped a gun to me in a box without any placing packing material of any type at all and wrote on the box do not bend, fold or mutilate. Gun was a project gun and arrived in about the same shape it was shipped in by shear dumb luck.
One of the best shippers is Brian of Afghanistan. Well packed and great dealer to work with. KY Jon, Thanks for the endorsement. Unfortunately my shop is closed until I get back. As far as shipping goes, having boxes made to my specs is not very expensive. I get them for long guns and for double guns and they come with sleeves and everything. Makes my job a whole lot easier and protects the gun. My shipping peeves are mostly with guys who ship double guns not knocked down. that long 2 pc stock type gun assembly is always more prone to damage when shipped assembled. I tell them that if they ship in a long gun case to break it down. I had a well know dealer ship me a German double rifle in a cheap plastic case inside a huge box with no other cushion. He shipped the gun assembled. It arrived with the stock broken through the wrist.
Brian
LTC, USA Ret.
NRA Patron Member
AHFGCA Life Member
USPSA Life Member
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,381 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,381 Likes: 1 |
I think folks know Srebro is Slavic while Silver is.... Jewish? 
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 417
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 417 |
Me thinks, in the future, I will ask first, if seller will pay shipping, if his assessment of the guns condition is "Grossly" flawed, and if he won't, then I'll take my business elsewhere. I have bought many guns online with some nice surprises and some not so nice, but the good ones far outweigh the bad ones, and I definitely won't stop. The good far outweighs the bad, and I have been able to correct all problems that I have encountered. The truth is though, if I had been told the truth to begin with, I might not have gone with the deal...I am not inclined to send guns back, ever, but this thinking has cost me a lot of work and time. I think gun dealers have a natural tendency to try to get over on the GDP, [generally dumb public], and they can't help themselves...kind of like used car salesmen.
There's one dealer that is good member on this forum, that I bought a English Hammer Double from, before I became a member here, that told me the gun had a good solid stock with no cracks. When I got it in, it had a recessed hole, with a wood screw, just behind the tang, going from top to bottom of the POW grip, that actually held the break together, because there was no glue of any kind in the crack, and without the screw, the stock would have been in 2 pieces. I also looked at all the pics of it on his web site, and surprise, surprise, not one showed that portion of the stock. In summary, after much work, it is now one of my favorites, and I am so glad I didn't send it back, but it is something I should have been told about. I consider suppression of known flaws is outright lying, regardless of his lie of telling me the stock was solid with no cracks.
I am very happy with the gun now, and consider it his loss...it came out beautiful, and I basically enjoyed the time I spent on the restoration.
binko
I'm now a PORN Star! - Poor - Old - Retired - & Needy
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 173
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 173 |
Dear Serban,
My experience is that the standard is 3 day inspection and return for the purchase price minus shipping.
Phil
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 417
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 417 |
I understand the standard, Phil, but that precludes an outright lie. If the flaw is plainly visible and hidden from the buyer by the seller, than I don't think the buyer should pay for the return. The only reason the gun got shipped, to begin with, is the sellers deceitfulness, so he should pay the cost of ALL shipping.
binko
I'm now a PORN Star! - Poor - Old - Retired - & Needy
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,935
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,935 |
Well, I think we've discussed this before, but the long and short of it is you won't be getting a refund on shipping. It's the price you pay for doing business long distance. Morally, he does owe you a refund, and maybe you could sue him for a refund and win it, but it's not worth the outlay.
But, look at it this way - assuming the facts you have stated are true, he's exposed himself to you as a liar and worse even a person with lousy gun knowledge. So you are out a hundred bucks - he's out his dignity. I'd rather be in your shoes than his.
I think there's probably something to this whole Karma thing - maybe someday he'll be rolled into the OR in desperate need of kidney transplant. The delivery driver bringing the kidney will be so caught up in an angry phone call with the dealer's secretary trying to get a refund for a lied-about gun that he'll
accidentally leave the kidney on the dash of his minivan.....
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,268 Likes: 93
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,268 Likes: 93 |
The scope was described as perfectly functional. In fact, the mounts would not hold the scope on the gun. The scope had the elevation tourette move on the shaft, the adjustment knobs were stuck. The ocular is moving.
The gun had the rifle barrel relined.
One of the triggers, while working, had a very hard pull and a lot of creep.
I have bought guns in poor condition from other sellers....
The intention of the topic is to bring awareness on this dealer. It might be malitious and unfair to some, but this is my side of the story. So, the plot thickens. Here we have a pre-war (70-years-old or older) 12-bore Sauer shotgun with rifle barrel attached, and scope detached, priced at $5,500. One might question what element of the $5,500 price a 4X scope contributes to a relatively expensive collector's item of a shotgun/rifle combo with iron sights? Or what is the chance of buying a similar shotgun/rifle combo at any price anywhere else? Or whether or not a relined rifle barrel on a 70+ year-old shotgun is a plus or minus in the eyes of different beholders? Or whether the subjective issue of trigger pull ("...hard pull, creep...") isn't something that different persons might evaluate differently? I have only met Steve Barnett in passing at such places as the Vintage Cup, and someday, if and when I get to Mississippi, I'd like to see his shop, which from his ads looks like a place to spend a whole day. Steve is a major Parker dealer and to the extent that I have seen his guns displayed and handled a few, he is a top notch dealer with things of value to sell. But this is the Internet, where everybody gets their say, even Silver, who paraphrased says: "It might be malicious and unfair to some...[for me]...to bring awareness on this dealer...[as I]...have bought guns in poor condition from other sellers...[and]...this is my side of the story." So here is the solution to this sort of difference of opinion in the future: TO SAVE POSTAGE, get in your car and drive from Montana to Mississippi (or wherever) to look at an antique $5,500 shotgun/rifle combo next time. You can fiddle with the trigger and see if the removable scope suits you; if the cost to the prior owner to "reline" the rifle barrel did not add value to your way of thinking, then walk away...all that's lost is, maybe, 2,500- to 3,000-miles on your vehicle and 4 or 5 days of your time. Or maybe paying postage to look at someone else's $5,500 antique gun and having the stay-at-home option to say "yes, I'll keep it," or "No, I'd like my money back," ain't such a bad deal after all. My understanding is that dealers like Steve Barnett with actual stores and national reputations always give a right to return for reason or no reason whatsoever. Silver got his money back. The idea that dealers are to pay a potential buyer's postage, which is incurred solely because the buyer chooses not to shop in person at the seller's store, is just plain silly. And the idea that the detachable scope (not even pictured in the auction listing) translates into a gun "...in poor condition" Oh! Poo! EDM.....his user name is sliver! I think Mr. Barnett wouldn't have a business in Mississippi if it wasn't for on line sales. So being truthful with good pictures is to his advantage. Obviously he chose not to be!
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,381 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,381 Likes: 1 |
There appears to be at least 7 folks who had good transactions with Stevie. Just look under 16ga guns at 16ga.com.
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