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Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 738
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 738 |
I just bought a Henry Pieper Cape gun. The rifle is .375 H & H mag (re-chambered). I know how to make that work with Barnes bullets. What I am trying to figure out is what can I do for a non-toxic slug in the smoothbore cylinder barrel. All of the copper stuff is in sabots. For accuracy don't these require rifling?
Any suggestions?
Could the smoothbore barrel be rifled?
Need to hunt in CA condor Country with non-toxic (BS) bullets
Thanks
Jerry
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 236
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 236 |
Gerald, Try shotgunworld.com and look under slug shooters on the forum index. Rich
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,579 Likes: 88
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,579 Likes: 88 |
Gerald have you shot the 375 or seen it shot? I haven't seen a cape gun yet that I would rechamber to 375 magnum. Most were made for black powder rounds. Is it a modern made gun? Be real careful.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
Gerald, I agree with Mike. Most of the Pieper cape guns I have seen were produced during the black powder era. You say it has been "rechambered". I can not imagine that the action or the barrel will be capable of handling an elephant round. I shoot a 375 H&H. A full power load will produce 62,000 PSI. http://www.handloads.com/misc/saami.htmThat is well beyond what that action can handle. Pete
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,579 Likes: 88
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,579 Likes: 88 |
Gerald are you sure its chambered for the 375 H&H? There is a .375 flanged nitro express 2 1/2". This would make more sence to me as I'd shoot it in a cape gun. Page 390 11th edition of Cartridges of the world.
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 433
Member
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Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 433 |
Jerry:
I have to agree with Mike and Pete.
I think maybe I saw the ad for this gun online. It said ".375 H & H Flanged". Didn't say magnum. That would possibly suggest a non-expert reference to .375 2 1/2" Flanged Nitro Express, as opposed to .375 Flanged Magnum.
Henri Pieper died in 1898 and his firm was taken over by his son, Nicolas. My understanding is that the business was continued in the the son's name. My hunch is that if your Cape Gun is marked Henri Pieper, it was made before 1898. No such gun would be suitable for rechambering to .375 Magnum. Is this a hammergun?
Are there any original caliber markings on this gun? It's possible that it was rechambered from .38-55 to .375 2 1/2" Flanged NE. In the 1880's & 90's, Henri Pieper made quite a few Cape Guns with the rifle barrel in .38-55 Winchester. Pressure-wise, the .375 2 1/2" Flanged NE is close enough to make a rechambering feasible. Not so the .375 Magnum.
So...are you sure that this rifle has been rechambered to .375 Magnum? Have you made a chamber cast? If you're sure that it has been rechambered to Magnum, has it been properly reproved? What do the proof marks say? If it has been rechambered to Magnum but has not been reproved, don't even think about firing it.
I would strongly recommend against using Barnes monos, or any other homogenous bullet, in a Cape Gun or double rifle of this age. If you have no choice but to hunt in a no-tox area, use a single barrel rifle.
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 165 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 165 Likes: 1 |
Jerry,
I own a Henri Pieper cape gun, back action locks, rebounding hammers, it is chambered in 12 ga 2 1/2 & 38-55 and is marked so on the action flats under the shotgun bbl. It is a nice Belgium
made cape gun with a horn butt plate with widows peak, Anson Deely forend latch with a horn wedge in the forend, 30" bbl's. I am willing to sell mine as I collect mainly German guns but the Pieper's were a nice Belgium gun as he was the second largest Belgium gunmaker behind FN.
M-4
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
Actually, Henri Pieper was born, 1840, in Soest ( Westphalia ) which is in modern Germany. Pieper was one of the original investors in FN. In 1905 Pieper produced 60,000 shotguns, 30,000 hand guns, 30,000 rifles and 12 million cartridges. Pieper never experienced the crippling strikes that FN did.
Eventually FN did out pace all other Belgian makers.
Pete
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 738
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 738 |
Yes you are all correct, a full load 375 H & H mag would be to much for that gun and I do not intend to to shoot new ammo in it or take an elephant with it!
The handloads for it are loaded to 2200 fps with only a 235 grain bullet. (vs 2700 -2800 fps) It was re-chambered to that and to keep the pressures low, the only way to do that is to handload. It was chambered for some 9.? x ??R. It has an 18 to 1 twist and it cannot stabilize longer bullets. I am hoping I won't have a problem with the Barnes! If I do, I'll have to have someone machine the Barnes Bullet shorter! (Yikes $)
The gun is tight as a tick, has heavy barrels and the shotgun barrel is steel not damascus. ( I bought it)
I bought it just for fun and maybe to shoot a pig with it at my favorite water hole. I do appreciate the warnings.
Now how about my non-toxic slug questions.
Thanks guys.
Jerry
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