doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com 9,3 x 72r proof markings? Info request !

Would like to ask those that have a drilling that is known to be chambered for the 9,3 x 72r round to please post proof info as found on the rifle barrels. What I am looking for is for both pre and post-WW1 era proof data in order to verify a drillings chambering that I will be considering for purchase. I have recently seen a few drilling for sale where the seller claims that the drilling is chambered in 9,3 x 72r but proof info does not seem to bear this out. Looking for conformation of my notes about the proof stamps for this cartridge at this stage of the game. thanks in advance! Jeff S.

One with the 118,35 stamp which is 0.358" 9.3X72R. But a combo has the 118,35 stamp and 9.3 mark a little lower but it is a 360 2 1/4" Express variant. I've found too many folk to guess wrong and wouldn't trust any guess until a chamber cast.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Jeff;
I have a hammer drilling with the rifle bbl in 9.3x72R by "Miller & Val Greiss, München". Proof date is 6,13.
Caliber marking (Proof House) is 8.8m/m over 72. It carries a Crown/N followed by K.m.G/12.7gr. This indicates a bore dia of about .3465" or .0175" smaller than the normal .364" bullet dia of the 9.3x72R & a smokeless proof for a Copper Jacketed Bullet of 12.7 grams (196 grains). Prior to 1912 "most" 9.3x72R's will not carry the smokeless proof & may be proofed for a lead bullet (Bl.G). Also early guns can carry a "Gauge" marking for the rifle & depending upon exact bore dia may be either 108,5 (.350") or 118,35 (.340"). These were measured with plug gauges which were in .010" increments. Thus if the bore accepted the .350" plug it would have been marked 108,5, if not but did accept the .340" one then a 118,35. Some variations will occur, but this is the only one I have to give actual markings. The 9.3x72R originated for use with lead bullets & when offered in a jacketed bullet version the jackets were rather thin & soft, thus deep rifling seems to have been maintained, at least for some amount of time.
Hope this is of some help to you.

Jeff,

I can not say enough for a chamber cast. I recently purchased a drilling that I was told by the seller was 9.3x72r. After the chamber cast it became clear it was actually a 9.3x82r. There were no proof marks to indicate the cartridge. With Raimey's help, I was able to narrow down the dating of this gun to about 1900.

The other advantage of a chamber cast is that you can later send it off to Ace Dube and have a 22 Hornet insert made for about $70. Mine is currently on order.

Another issue is that there were two 9.3x72r cartridges. Here is a partial listing of potential candidates:
9.3 x 57 R (.360)
9.3 x 65 R
9.3 x 70 R (.360)
9.3 x 72 R (.360)
9.3 x 72 R Sauer
9.3 x 74 R
9.3 x 75 R (.360)Nimrod
9.3 x 80 R (.360)Nimrod
9.3 x 82 R (.360)Nimrod

Pete

I agree with Raimey, Miller and Pete - there's just no set of marks that are definitive for this kind of gun. Some marks may help, but with all the possible variations even in the 9,3x72R cartridge itself (body tapers, rim thickness, bore and groove) the only way you can be certain of the internal dimensions is a chamber cast and bore slug.

PeteM:

That's my point exactly and then with the individual cartridges, there are slight variations due to the fact that up to a point in time the diameters weren't standarized. And as 2-Piper stated the plug gauge measurement was just like a scattergun: which one will pass? Most of the 360 variants have black powder origins; load, rifling. I actually prefer the pre-1893 longarms as most don't have any indication and are a guess until the cast is made. But if you have the 108,5 & 118,35 and the slug reveals, then the 200gr 38 bullets are usually close in diameter and readily available.

Nice show & tell 2-Piper.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Miller,

After all these years, of attending your classes, where do I send the tuition?

Pete

Pete;
I think I have gained more from your "Classes" than you have from mine, so tuition has been paid in full. I had totally forgotten that 9.3x72R Sauer till you mentioned it. A bottleneck case as I recall having more potential than the more common straight tapered one. Not sure, but quite possibly the inspiration for the still slightly larger & much more powerful 9.3x74R.

2-piper:

I believe you are correct and the round was manufactured during the 1920s and prior to WWI. It closer resemebled the 9.3X74R than any of the 9.3X72 Express cartridges and was possibly also known as 9.3X72 S&S.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

These are the Sauer cartridges, most of them...

6.5x48R Sauer : (GSP17)
6.5x58R Sauer : (GSP18)
6.5x65R Sauer : (GSP19)
8x48R Sauer : (GSP21)
6.5x70R Sauer : (GSP20)
8x58R Sauer : (GSP22)
9x58R Sauer : (GSP24)
9.3x72R Sauer : (GSP25)
10x50R Sauer : (GSP26)



This is the 9.3x74R


Pete