doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com How Do You Close A SxS

I'm all ears....convince me from a "metalurigical perspective".

All either do or have. I have never advocated pointing a gun at a dog. You must hunt with a pack of dogs if it isn't possible to raise your gun without sweeping a dog. BTW Try hunting rabbits with beagles, it's not hard to learn not to shoot the dogs.

You have never answered the question where is the muzzle pointed if you stumble or fall. This spring my son and I were turkey hunting, walking in before dawn with the guns unloaded and I was carrying mine muzzle up, trying to quietly pick my way through the woods. I stepped on a limb covered with wet leaves and landed flat on my back with the gun pointed right at my son.

BTW I've been through Ohio's hunter safety course 4 times, once for myself and 3 times with my kids. They never discouraged muzzle down carry. I've read untold numbers of gun/hunting books and don't remember any taking a hard stand against muzzle down carry. I googled the subject and only found one place (a pay to shoot place) that required muzzle up carry. To be honest of all the hunters I hunted with (probably well over 100)I've never met anyone with your opinion.

For myself, when hunting with my dogs, the gun is broken across my shoulder and only gets shut when the dogs are on point. If a bird flys up, so be it. I would be very unhappy to hunt with someone with a loaded shotgun pointing down. Double guns are safest of all guns. Keep them broke untill needed.

Way back on p. 2, Dick mentions that he reassessed his method by noting the position of the toplever when "eased" vs. the position when snapped. I'd bet those of us who have done the same have noticed that the lever is further to the right when eased. As the boltbone is connected to the cambone is connected to the spindlebone etc., that can only mean that the bolt isn't seated as deep in the lug. With a protruding Greener xbolt, you can directly observe the difference in seating. In a later post, mention in made of "pushing" the lever to final position. That adds another ingredient to the procedural soup. The one gun I have seen which absolutely required the manual assist after being "snapped" was a Stoeger Condor 20 ga. used frequently for skeet in my presence. I don't think anyone will argue that the escopeta from Ipanima is anything but a utility grade gun. Lot of fit/frictional interference there somewhere and it shows. Maybe some very slick examples of better heritage and execution will "ease" just as deep as they'll "snap". I think if you have to push the lever left, closing the gun with the lever may be creating more frictional wear than simply closing the gun [completely] with the "snap" ensuring that the bolt goes home unimpeded. Big difference between inserting a wedge and driving a wedge; the difference could be frictional wear and tear.

jack

I think closing the action works just fine either way. As for the barrels up or down argument, I don't think that matters either so long as you have control of where the gun is pointed at all times you are always aware of what's in front of the barrels...Geo

http://www.hunter-ed.com/in/course/ch6_safely_carrying_firearms.htm

Note that the two muzzle-down carry positions are the least safe. 'Ready carry' cites the safety advantage of muzzle up.

We seem to be discussing, or confusing, two different procedures here.One is the loading position and the other is the carry position.I have no problem with carrying the gun in a muzzle up position but I haven't figured out yet how you keep the cartridges in the chambers if you try to load with the muzzles pointing up,and I ain't going to be hunting anywhere near anyone who has his action close with the barrels in a horizontal position, regardless of whether or not he thinks they are pointing in a safe direction...

I just hope Osama O'Bama doesn't read this thread...it could change his position on gun control.

it's almost changed mine.

Terry - the topic began with lever-thumbing (pro and con) and evolved into loading and then to carry - because they are a continuum.

No one advocates loading with muzzles up - barrels are always down when you load cartridges. The issue is whether the loaded gun should be closed and ready to fire while the barrels are pointed down at the ground (caused by lifting the butt to the barrels), or up (caused by lifting the barrels to the action).

The "lift your butt" rule may have originated with Old Etonians, harking back to a British public school tradition.

I was intrigued by this post as I have been hearing alternating opinions for years so I phoned up a friend who is a top shot AND was a managing director at Holland and Holland for a while and is very much engaged in the business now. He said "I always close my gun by bringing the stock up to the barrels (the other way round if I am in a real hurry...) and the top lever closes of its own accord- I don't hold it open and then push it closed. I honestly don't think it makes that much difference."

Funnily enough I was always in the other school who held it open, I guess I might try the other way now as long as it is not slammed shut