doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com WW Greener 10ga List No. 55

Over the weekend I had the chance to examine a W.W. Greener 10ga serial no. 41203. Gun is tight and on face. Does not appear to have been shot much. Rounded PG stock with 14" LOP to checkered butt with horn heel and toe plates. Splinter forend with ebony tip. Nice wood with very fine checkering. Finish is 90% Frame is nicely engraved 40-50% coverage. Engraving is still sharp. Trigger guard tang is engraved List No. 55. Double triggers naturally. Case colors are nonexistant except for water table and underside of forend iron. Water table and barrel flats are stamped with Birmingham definitive black powder proof, a 10 over C inside a diamond, followed by Choke. England is also stamped on the water table as well as on the barrel flats. Barrels flats are also stamped with 11 at breech and the barrels are stamped with Birmingham provisional and definitive black powder proofs as well as Trade Mark with Elephant, serials numbers on each barrel match serial number on frame and forend. Barrels retain 80% original blue with no dents, dings, or pits. A pigeon is engraved on the rib at breech followed by locations and a series of dates of events won. The barrels only measure 29 3/4" however at the bore the barrels are touching.

I know nothing about the value of black powder Greeners.

Bottom line do you think its worth $2,700.

According to Greeners book the gun was built in 1893 and if it has steel barrels this would be a plus as most Greeners of this period had damascus.The gun sounds like a medium quality gun of the period.The barrel length sounds a little suspect,ie possibly shortened, so they should be measured to see what choke is there plus what the bore diameter is relative to the 11 proof mark. The other factors that affects value are the stock dimensions ie. drop at comb and heel. If the drop is not excessive and the barrel length is original,good barrel wall thickness,then the price sounds realistic IMHO

Terry,
The barrels are Greener's Wrought Steel.

Thanks for the suggestion to measure wall thickness and length of choke.
Michael

W.W.Greener should be able to document the original barrel length. They will also confirm the grade of the gun.

I always think of 10s as 2 types, heavy and light. The heavy guns go 9-11+ lbs. Light is 8-9, sometimes sub-8 but they are rare. The light guns are more useable for clays and Vintage Competitions. The heavy guns are better suited to hunting waterfowl.

$2700 is alot for a gun with virtually no factory ammo available. If it were a 12 ejector it would be a good price. A 10 extractor would be a lot less valuable.

Rocketman will apply "the formula" and give you a fair estimate. Some dealers think 10 is rarer and worth more, in fact to most Vintagers I know, it is worth less. The last Greener 10 bought by a Carolina Vintager was $850, but did not have the condition you describe.
If the gun has light weight, ejectors, a top safety and modern stock dimensions, correct barrels in a Greener (or period) case, it is priced fairly. If it has a side safety, is heavy, with trimmed barrels, out of proof, weird dimensioned, uncased, it would struggle to bring half the asking price.
Nitro-Proof became optional in 1896, since the gun is dated 1893, it confirms the proof marks are correct. However, it also means the gun has not seen the proof house in 115 years. A professional measurement of the barrels would confirm that the gun is unmolested. The chamber length should be 2 7/8". Real early 10s were 2 5/8". If it has longer chambers the 10 C mark would be 10 LC for long chamber. Any chamber length greater than 2 7/8" would be suspect.

If you do opt for the gun, empty 10 hulls are 40+cents each, plus wads, shot and powder. I figure about 75 cents a shot with todays lead prices. A 100 shot round of clays is $75 of shells plus range fees. You can use ChamerMates to reduce the 10 to 12 and the shoot Polywad's 2 1/2" low pressure shells. Modern 2 3/4" US loads will be too high a pressure for the gun. There were some RST short 10s for sale at the Vintage Cup. It seems they were around $15 for box of 10.

Joe