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Joined: Mar 2002
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Shotgunlover,you should have found new friends .friends don't let friends shoot coggies:)

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“ If you don’t know if you can get the discs out, or, own the tool or a spare set of strikes, dollars to donuts the gun is in the field, and hasn’t been serviced.”

Huh? Or Ted, dollars to donuts, maybe they have their guns serviced by a gunsmith? I’d hazard a guess and say an extremely high percentage of people who own doubles, vintage or modern, don’t posses the proper tools, parts, skills or experience to repair, strip & clean or inspect a doublegun.
And let’s be honest here…..90+% of vintage/modern double gun owners don’t have their guns serviced on the regular….usually the only time a gun gets serviced is when something goes wrong. The fraternity that has their guns completely serviced on the regular is very limited to almost non existent.
The vast majority of guns that come into a good friends shop for complete strip & cleans are almost entirely best grade guns owned by very well off people. You don’t see too many “regular” type guns, boxlock or sidelock, in the shop for strip & cleans. Most people who own doubles are not willing to pay $300+ for for a complete strip & clean of a boxlock actioned gun.
I have quite a few local pals and a few more abroad who own doubles….none of them seem to own the tools nor posses the skills to completely take down or adjust a boxlock or sidelock shotgun, especially ejector mechanisms. They mostly all take very good care of their guns and have them serviced by a reputable gunsmith, and sometimes even trust their guns to me for minor fixes and strip & cleans, finishing etc.
Point being, they don’t do any of the work themselves and their guns hit the field ready to go and provide them with virtually flawless service.

Yep, in the world of doubleguns, you’re an anomaly. One of the few that can take down & service most of his own guns. That’s awesome and the skill set is definitely beneficial. Like doctors…the goal is to do no harm. Unfortunately, I’ve seen a lot of instances of lots of harm being done by unskilled hands. Trying to remove stubborn disk from the breach face is one them. Trying to remove pins and screws with ill fitting turnscrews is another. Cocking actions or squeezing springs using hardened steel tools is a common bugaboo too. Imagine just anyone digging into a Perkes, Wem or Baker ejector mechanism, or trying their hand at completely taking down a Purdey. Catastrophe.😳
If you don’t posses the tools, skills or knowledge….let a pro or well stocked, skilled enthusiast handle it.

Hell Ted, most people who own extremely simple guns like 1100’s and 870’s barely know how to break down their guns for a service! I just had a friends Browning A-500R on the bench for a strip & clean, there was enough dirt, seeds and crap in that gun one could’ve planted a field. Said his dad shot it for over a decade and one day, about 10 years ago, it just stopped working. Hmmmmmm. What a mystery.😂
I don’t think the gun had ever been taken apart other than to clean the barrel and wipe down the outside. I believe this is pretty typical when it comes to a majority of gun owners.

2 members like this: Ted Schefelbein, Tim Cartmell
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What Le Fusil said!

Especially this: "Most people who own doubles are not willing to pay $300+ for for a complete strip & clean of a boxlock actioned gun."

1 member likes this: Ted Schefelbein
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Morphy's Auctions has a 16 gauge W&S 400 in its next auction. Lot no. 2193. They certainly were handsome guns.

1 member likes this: Ted Schefelbein
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It is a very nice gun, just a little heavy, but maybe light enough.


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...never pay Dave "one more dime"
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Dustin,
After I’ve been through a gun, it won’t get touched again for years. I don’t get to shoot thousands of rounds through them, or clock out of my day to day life for a few months, hunting birds. But, everything gets taken down when I come into it. And, you do the same. It should be the case for any old gun, but, I’ll bet you are correct, guys just run ‘em until they break. That’s a shame, but, it is what it is.
That 400 at the auction house is a neat old gun. I’d be interested from the posters in England what a gun like that would sell for, today, in an English gun shop. Bet it isn’t anywhere near the price Morphy’s thinks they are going to get.

It isn’t heavy, either.


Best,
Ted

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Originally Posted by Ted Schefelbein
Dustin,
After I’ve been through a gun, it won’t get touched again for years. I don’t get to shoot thousands of rounds through them, or clock out of my day to day life for a few months, hunting birds. But, everything gets taken down when I come into it. And, you do the same. It should be the case for any old gun, but, I’ll bet you are correct, guys just run ‘em until they break. That’s a shame, but, it is what it is.
That 400 at the auction house is a neat old gun. I’d be interested from the posters in England what a gun like that would sell for, today, in an English gun shop. Bet it isn’t anywhere near the price Morphy’s thinks they are going to get.

It isn’t heavy, either.


Best,
Ted

it isn't light, either.


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...never pay Dave "one more dime"
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Okay, just to get things straight here, the W&S 400 in the Morphy's Auction is a Grade 1 Morphy's Auction example, the Hallowell's W&S 400 is a Grade 2 Hallowell's example? and Joe Wood's W&S 400 Properitory model is a Grade 3 Joe Wood's Proprietary example? Is this correct?

Also in Joe Wood's Proprietary model, it looks to me like the hinge pin has a screw? Does this mean the hinge pin is replaceable in the Proprietary grade?

Thanks.

Webley & Scott, Model 400 Series, Grade 3. Earlier version, 1914 W&S catalogue.

or

Webley & Scott, Model 400 Series, Grade 3. Later version?


TC
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Pretty sure the hinge pin was serviceable in any 400, and not in the 700. Doesn’t seem that “gunman” has been in these parts for most of a year, that is a shame, as he knows all those guns quite well, and I hope he is doing fine.

Best,
Ted

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Hinge pin isn’t serviceable. The 400, 500, 600, 700 all have solid pins. The pins are for the cocking levers and I believe the second set is for the ejector trips.

I might be going out on a limb here, but the only serviceable hinge pins that I can remember were found on a FEW W&S 700 actions when H&H acquired the company and they built the Bowood & Northwood model, and not all of those models were built on that unique hinge pin action. The actions made with a removable hing pin are pretty rare birds.

2 members like this: Ted Schefelbein, Tim Cartmell
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