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nca225:

Ill tell you what, heres a challenge. Go through my last post paragraph by paragraph. Offer some evidence (not talking points, fact based evidence) or an alternative point to prove what I wrote is inaccurate or simply false.

No insults, attacks, or name calling allowed. No mentioning Trump. Write your counter-points not as a liberal or democrat but as a fellow American citizen.

Its called civil, respectful debate. Can you do it?

Your turn,

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Originally Posted By: canvasback


Moral Relativism Chris. It's one of the foundational mistakes of the Left.

Either you are in bed with them or you are not. You can't pick and choose. "oh, it serves my interests here, but over here, where it makes no difference, I'll take a stand."


I think that pretty much is the most BS and poorly considered response I think you have ever given CB, but I don't want to jump to conclusions.

So lets paint a clear picture here. You think that that since the US government of the late 40's and 50's (elected well before I was born or keith could vote), employed former german scientists of the 3rd Reich because of their knowledge of rocket science to advance our national interest and security, that makes it OK for an individual, in their individual capacity to have dealings with Nazi's, in this case while one is cheering on the killing of jews? Is that what you are getting at?

Does that also mean that since the US government of the late 40's and 50's (elected well before I was born or keith could vote), employed former german scientists of the 3rd Reich because of their knowledge of rocket science to advance our national interest and security, that Nazi's are no longer bad?

Does that also mean that since the US government of the late 40's and 50's (elected well before I was born or keith could vote), employed former german scientists of the 3rd Reich because of their knowledge of rocket science to advance our national interest and security, that the murder of 6 million jews should no longer be of much concern?

Thinking about it some more, does that also mean that since the US government of the 1800s (elected well before I was born or keith could vote), as a policy, invaded the land of, killed and or confined its original occupants to reservations, that now, should one want to have their neighbor's property they can do the same? The US government did it to those people, so why can't we do it to these people?

Last edited by nca225; 01/01/21 10:45 AM.

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Originally Posted By: OldMaineWoodsman
nca225:

Ill tell you what, heres a challenge. Go through my last post paragraph by paragraph. Offer some evidence (not talking points, fact based evidence) or an alternative point to prove what I wrote is inaccurate or simply false.

No insults, attacks, or name calling allowed. No mentioning Trump. Write your counter-points not as a liberal or democrat but as a fellow American citizen.

Its called civil, respectful debate. Can you do it?

Your turn,


Here's what I am getting at Woodsman.. I'll stipulate to what you have as Biden's plans on gun control. While I don't agree with that particular policy, it occurs to me that I am more aligned with the policies of the Democratic platform the I am with the GOP's.

To wit:

I am uncomfortable trading a women's right to do what she wants with her body so that I can possess whatever firearm I may fancy.

I am uncomfortable trading a persons right to cohabitate and marry whoever they wish so that I can possess whatever firearm I may fancy.

I am uncomfortable trading a transgendered child's right to live free from harassment so that I can possess whatever firearm I may fancy.

I am uncomfortable trading the well being of the environment so that I can possess whatever firearm I may fancy. - This actually does more to serve my hunting as well, because the mass migration that will eventually be caused by climate change is going to effect more then just humans and if there is no game around to shoot, then whats the point having a gun to shoot them?

I am uncomfortable trading the established scientific method so that I can possess whatever firearm I may fancy.

I am also reluctant to expose myself to predatory banking, lending or investment practices so that I can possess whatever firearm I may fancy.

I do hope that you see where my point was and that this clears it up for you.

Last edited by nca225; 01/01/21 02:03 PM.

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The only thing it makes clear, is you cant counter or dispute what I wrote.

As they say in court, no further questions.

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Originally Posted By: OldMaineWoodsman
The only thing it makes clear, is you cant counter or dispute what I wrote.

As they say in court, no further questions.


UMMMM, you do realize that's what I lead with? That by stipulating to Biden's gun control plans, I wasn't disputing it.


That is what stipulate means.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/stipulate

Seems to me you are trying to declare victory when there was no fight.

Last edited by nca225; 01/01/21 11:13 AM.

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Originally Posted By: nca225
Originally Posted By: canvasback


Moral Relativism Chris. It's one of the foundational mistakes of the Left.

Either you are in bed with them or you are not. You can't pick and choose. "oh, it serves my interests here, but over here, where it makes no difference, I'll take a stand."


I think that pretty much is the most BS and poorly considered response I think you have ever given CB, but I don't want to jump to conclusions.

So lets paint a clear picture here. You think that that since the US government of the late 40's and 50's (elected well before I was born or keith could vote), employed former german scientists of the 3rd Reich because of their knowledge of rocket science to advance our national interest and security, that makes it OK for an individual, in their individual capacity to have dealings with Nazi's, in this case while one is cheering on the killing of jews? Is that what you are getting at?

Does that also mean that since the US government of the late 40's and 50's (elected well before I was born or keith could vote), employed former german scientists of the 3rd Reich because of their knowledge of rocket science to advance our national interest and security, that Nazi's are no longer bad?

Does that also mean that since the US government of the late 40's and 50's (elected well before I was born or keith could vote), employed former german scientists of the 3rd Reich because of their knowledge of rocket science to advance our national interest and security, that the murder of 6 million jews should no longer be of much concern?

Thinking about it some more, does that also mean that since the US government of the 1800s (elected well before I was born or keith could vote), as a policy, invaded the land of, killed and or confined its original occupants to reservations, that now, should one want to have their neighbor's property they can do the same? The US government did it to those people, so why can't we do it to these people?


Laughable Chris.

Is there any evidence Keith has been cheering for the killing of Jews? Is there any evidence Keith bought anything from an avowed anti Semite Nazi who supported Hitler's final solution? You are doing to Keith what I am always bitching at him about....making unsubstantiated leaps to impugn motive or belief.

Not for a second did my comment suggest the US government stopped thinking Nazis were bad or that 6 million murdered Jews were no longer a concern. And the application of those wild leaps to the indigenous situation is beyond foolish.

The point my comment makes is that the US in it's infinite wisdom decided to move on at the end of WWII. They looked at their utterly vanquished foes, learned the lessons of the Treaty of Versailles, and set about building Japan and German up again, in a different mold. A policy that, 75 years on, seems to have worked extremely well. In doing so, they held those most responsible to account but let the vast majority of people in those countries move forward with their lives.

Were there those who continued to support Nazism? Sure there were. Did they live among us? Sure they did. But so did communists who you don't hold to account for the Holomodor. Who you don't hold to account for the Cultural Revolution and Great Leap Forward. Regimes and philosophies that made the Nazis look like amateurs when it comes to killing.

Your regular attacks on Keith as a Nazi sympathizer are both stupid (you have no evidence) and hypocritical (you support philosophical stances that killed far more in the 20th century and continue to do so to this day).

Pick a different bat to beat Keith about with, if you can find one. This one only looks bad on you.


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I'll try to make this real easy for Sissy Chrissy nca225.

Before I even had a drivers license, I would sometimes hop on my bicycle, and ride to the gunsmith shop owned by a former German soldier.

He was not a Death Camp Guard or an S.S. Member. He was an armorer who was given the job of removing the wood stocks from guns that were confiscated by the Nazi's when they conquered a town or city. Then he was supposed to crush the barrels and action in a press to render it unusable, and the scrap was sent to steel mills to produce steel, ostensibly for the war effort.

Gene stashed some of the nicer guns he was supposed to scrap. He was literally stealing material for the war effort from the Nazi's. Had he been caught, I'd imagine the punishment would be severe. He was not being heroic. He merely saw gorgeous guns about to be destroyed, and decided to save what he could for himself.

He managed to get these guns smuggled into the U.S. when he emmigrated here after the war. He and his wife became U.S. Citizens, and he was able to both own firearms, and hold an FFL. He repaired and built guns, and he also sold guns. I never saw any of the very nice guns he stole from the Nazi's being sold. They were part of his very large personal collection or horde. I never saw one individual who had so many guns.

Gene never offered me any of his guns that were stolen from the Nazi's, nor did I ever offer to buy any.

I do own a very nice Herrmann Eichhorn 16 gauge sidelock double, and a C.K. Ansorg drilling that I bought some years ago from a former U.S. soldier. They were likely G.I. bring-backs that most likely were taken from some German citizen during or after the war. There were also millions of war surplus Mausers, Walthers, and other German military weapons shipped and sold here after the war. Many of them were produced, used, and sold by Jew hating Nazi's.

Nobody on any gun forum has ever expressed concern that their surplus military or sporterized Mauser may have been used to kill Jews or American soldiers, or that it was produced by the Nazi's who killed over 6 million Jews.

There are still a lot of anti-semites and Jew haters in this country. Many are politicians and leaders of the Civil Rights movement, like Rev. Al Sharpton and Lewis Farrakhan. Jesse Jackson, who admitted spitting in the food of white people he served while working as a waiter in NYC, is a well known Jew hating anti-semite. I'm quite sure Sissy Chrissy would be proud to march alongside them in a BLM parade.

I am not responsible for what is in other people's hearts. I was at Gene's home in 1991 looking for parts for a Siamese Mauser. Gene and his wife had CNN on TV, and were cheering for Saddam to fire more Scud Missiles into Israel. A lot of Muslims and other Americans were happy to see Israel attacked. I have no doubt that Sissy Chrissy has bought many things from Muslim owned convenience stores or gas stations that were operated by Jew haters. A lot of Democrats voted for the Iraq War, and then reversed their position shortly thereafter, to undermine George Bush, and try to make him a one term President. Their efforts helped Saddam Hussein. Sissy Chrissy nca225 supports them blindly, because they are Democrats.

Sissy Chrissy nca225 keeps repeating that I went to Gene's shop and house knowing that he hated Jews. That is a complete lie. I never heard Gene express any anti-semitic sentiment in all the years I knew him, until that day in 1991.

Really though, Gene was a better person and a better American than Sissy Chrissy or any of our Libtards here. Gene would never have voted for Joe Biden, or any politician who would infringe upon the 2nd Amendment Rights of law abiding U.S. Citizens.

Sissy Chrissy talks about the Constitutional Right of voting without voter I.D., because it is a fundamental Constitutional right. Yet he/she is telling Oldmainewoodsman that the right to own a firearm is not important, and it is OK for Liberal Democrats to violate that fundamamental Right. Abortion, gay marriage, and prohibitions against making fun of transgenders like Sissy Chrissy are not found anywhere in the Constitution. Nor is there any Constitutional prohibition for verifying eligibility to vote.

Sissy Chrissy also supports Joe Biden even though he has promised to ban fracking and offshore drilling exploration, making the U.S. once again dependent upon Arab oil. Much of that Arab oil money has been used to launch terrorist attacks on Jews in Israel. It has been used to fund armies to destroy Israel.

Finally, Sissy Chrissy supports Joe Biden and Obama, even though Obama gave over $1.5 billion in cash to Iran and entered into the Iran Nuclear Deal which did nothing to stop Iran from enriching uranium and getting nuclear weapons.

Iran openly shouts "Death to America", and threatens to totally destroy Israel. Donald Trump got us out of the insane Iran Nuclear Deal and crushed them with sanctions that has them on the verge of failure. Altzheimer Joe Biden wants to put us back into the Iran Nuclear Deal, knowing they wish to kill every Jew in Israel. And Sissy Chrissy nca225 supports that... along with the other Libtards here.

Jew hating bastards! Closet Nazi's, no doubt.



A true sign of mental illness is any gun owner who would vote for an Anti-Gunner like Joe Biden.

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Originally Posted By: canvasback
Is there any evidence Keith has been cheering for the killing of Jews? Is there any evidence Keith bought anything from an avowed anti Semite Nazi who supported Hitler's final solution? You are doing to Keith what I am always bitching at him about....making unsubstantiated leaps to impugn motive or belief.


This is a bit disingenuous of you dont you think CB? I have never said it was keith cheering on the death of jews. Nor is the issue is whether keith concluded a purchase. Keith, by his own words admitted to going to the guys shop over many years, knowing full well where Gene and his ill begotten inventory came from. And keith knew Gene was a nazi, as keith has admitted in his own words.

Do you or would you frequent the shop of a former Nazi? I dont, not because there are none around, its because I wouldnt be caught dead in one let alone giving any kind of support by giving it my business. I know Im a liberal, but I do try to have some self-dignity and standards.

To make matters worse, while he was there to source a part for his mauser, there was Gene at that very moment cheering on the death of jews and it wasnt that disgusting act that prevented the transaction, it was that Gene wasnt feeling well enough to go look for the part. Are you seriously suggesting that if Gene had went and found the part, keith would not have purchased it?

That you cant recognize that there is something fundamentally wrong with the situation that keith painstakingly detailed, about trying to buy a part off of Gene while he is cheering on the death of Jews, indicates your judgment is severely compromised. But why am I surprised you frequently grasp onto outlandish and disproven conspiracy theories.


Originally Posted By: canvasback
Not for a second did my comment suggest the US government stopped thinking Nazis were bad or that 6 million murdered Jews were no longer a concern. And the application of those wild leaps to the indigenous situation is beyond foolish.


Its not. Its the logical extension of what you are suggesting. Thinking what you are arguing through draws this conclusion. Your not recognizing that is more evidence of a compromised judgment.

Originally Posted By: canvasback
Were there those who continued to support Nazism? Sure there were. Did they live among us? Sure they did. But so did communists who you don't hold to account for the Holomodor. Who you don't hold to account for the Cultural Revolution and Great Leap Forward. Regimes and philosophies that made the Nazis look like amateurs when it comes to killing.

Your regular attacks on Keith as a Nazi sympathizer are both stupid (you have no evidence) and hypocritical (you support philosophical stances that killed far more in the 20th century and continue to do so to this day).

Pick a different bat to beat Keith about with, if you can find one. This one only looks bad on you.


Kindly point out where I have ever said I support communism, condone the Holomodor or that I supported the Cultural Revolution and the Great Leap Forward. If you can do that you might as well point out where I have come out for successive five year plans and forced industrialization. But you wont, because I havent nor will I ever. To suggest otherwise is a disingenuous attack.


You should make up with keith, your getting to be more like him, which is sad.

Last edited by nca225; 01/01/21 01:28 PM.

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Originally Posted By: keith
I'll try to make this real easy for Sissy Chrissy nca225.

Before I even had a drivers license, I would sometimes hop on my bicycle, and ride to the gunsmith shop owned by a former German soldier.

He was not a Death Camp Guard or an S.S. Member. He was an armorer who was given the job of removing the wood stocks from guns that were confiscated by the Nazi's when they conquered a town or city. Then he was supposed to crush the barrels and action in a press to render it unusable, and the scrap was sent to steel mills to produce steel, ostensibly for the war effort.

Gene stashed some of the nicer guns he was supposed to scrap. He was literally stealing material for the war effort from the Nazi's. Had he been caught, I'd imagine the punishment would be severe. He was not being heroic. He merely saw gorgeous guns about to be destroyed, and decided to save what he could for himself.

He managed to get these guns smuggled into the U.S. when he emmigrated here after the war. He and his wife became U.S. Citizens, and he was able to both own firearms, and hold an FFL. He repaired and built guns, and he also sold guns. I never saw any of the very nice guns he stole from the Nazi's being sold. They were part of his very large personal collection or horde. I never saw one individual who had so many guns.

Gene never offered me any of his guns that were stolen from the Nazi's, nor did I ever offer to buy any.

I do own a very nice Herrmann Eichhorn 16 gauge sidelock double, and a C.K. Ansorg drilling that I bought some years ago from a former U.S. soldier. They were likely G.I. bring-backs that most likely were taken from some German citizen during or after the war. There were also millions of war surplus Mausers, Walthers, and other German military weapons shipped and sold here after the war. Many of them were produced, used, and sold by Jew hating Nazi's.

Nobody on any gun forum has ever expressed concern that their surplus military or sporterized Mauser may have been used to kill Jews or American soldiers, or that it was produced by the Nazi's who killed over 6 million Jews.

There are still a lot of anti-semites and Jew haters in this country. Many are politicians and leaders of the Civil Rights movement, like Rev. Al Sharpton and Lewis Farrakhan. Jesse Jackson, who admitted spitting in the food of white people he served while working as a waiter in NYC, is a well known Jew hating anti-semite. I'm quite sure Sissy Chrissy would be proud to march alongside them in a BLM parade.

I am not responsible for what is in other people's hearts. I was at Gene's home in 1991 looking for parts for a Siamese Mauser. Gene and his wife had CNN on TV, and were cheering for Saddam to fire more Scud Missiles into Israel. A lot of Muslims and other Americans were happy to see Israel attacked. I have no doubt that Sissy Chrissy has bought many things from Muslim owned convenience stores or gas stations that were operated by Jew haters. A lot of Democrats voted for the Iraq War, and then reversed their position shortly thereafter, to undermine George Bush, and try to make him a one term President. Their efforts helped Saddam Hussein. Sissy Chrissy nca225 supports them blindly, because they are Democrats.

Sissy Chrissy nca225 keeps repeating that I went to Gene's shop and house knowing that he hated Jews. That is a complete lie. I never heard Gene express any anti-semitic sentiment in all the years I knew him, until that day in 1991.

Really though, Gene was a better person and a better American than Sissy Chrissy or any of our Libtards here. Gene would never have voted for Joe Biden, or any politician who would infringe upon the 2nd Amendment Rights of law abiding U.S. Citizens.

Sissy Chrissy talks about the Constitutional Right of voting without voter I.D., because it is a fundamental Constitutional right. Yet he/she is telling Oldmainewoodsman that the right to own a firearm is not important, and it is OK for Liberal Democrats to violate that fundamamental Right. Abortion, gay marriage, and prohibitions against making fun of transgenders like Sissy Chrissy are not found anywhere in the Constitution. Nor is there any Constitutional prohibition for verifying eligibility to vote.

Sissy Chrissy also supports Joe Biden even though he has promised to ban fracking and offshore drilling exploration, making the U.S. once again dependent upon Arab oil. Much of that Arab oil money has been used to launch terrorist attacks on Jews in Israel. It has been used to fund armies to destroy Israel.

Finally, Sissy Chrissy supports Joe Biden and Obama, even though Obama gave over $1.5 billion in cash to Iran and entered into the Iran Nuclear Deal which did nothing to stop Iran from enriching uranium and getting nuclear weapons.

Iran openly shouts "Death to America", and threatens to totally destroy Israel. Donald Trump got us out of the insane Iran Nuclear Deal and crushed them with sanctions that has them on the verge of failure. Altzheimer Joe Biden wants to put us back into the Iran Nuclear Deal, knowing they wish to kill every Jew in Israel. And Sissy Chrissy nca225 supports that... along with the other Libtards here.

Jew hating bastards! Closet Nazi's, no doubt.



This nothing but a bunch of backpedaling BS. But I'll tell what princess, if I were frequenting the convenient store owned by a muslim, and I heard said muslim cheering on the death of jews, I wouldn't buy anything there and I would stop frequenting it.

You heard Gene cheering in the death of jews and that gave you no pause whatsoever and you have a coward's excuse for it.

Last edited by nca225; 01/01/21 12:54 PM.

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Originally Posted By: nca225


Kindly point out where I have ever said I support communism, condone the Holomodor or that I supported the Cultural Revolution and the Great Leap Forward. If you can do that you might as well point out where I have come out for successive five year plans and forced industrialization. But you wont, because I havent nor will I ever. To suggest otherwise is a disingenuous attack


I suppose you will deny your stated admiration for Che Gueverra when you jumped in to a Misfires discussion several years ago, and identified the little man in this diagram of a Libtard brain:



You can continue to try to call me a Nazi for the crime of going to the home of a guy who cheered Saddam Hussein while I was there. But the fact remains Sissy Chrissy... you openly continue to support Liberal Left Democrats who violate the Constitutional Rights of U.S. Citizens. Not only that, but by doing so, they prevent and prohibit law abiding citizens from the basic human right of self defense of their homes and families. Many people have died and been brutally attacked waiting for the police to arrive in places where guns are restricted, and you happily support that.

I don't think that trying to buy a bolt stop for a Siamese Mauser comes close to your complicity in helping criminals kill and attack innocent people by taking away their fundamental and Constitutional Gun Rights. But what would we expect from a Libtard like you who also supports the Liberal Democrats who support late term abortions??? Gene was a great humanitarian compared to a baby killer like you:



This is not about choice. There is little doubt that the millions of babies killed by abortion would choose to not be ripped apart and sucked out when they have developed nervous systems, and can react to painful stimuli.



A true sign of mental illness is any gun owner who would vote for an Anti-Gunner like Joe Biden.

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