doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com The Lead Ban. The European Experience.

Article on Shooting Times web site may interest some: https://www.shootinguk.co.uk/news/how-have-other-countries-coped-with-the-lead-shot-ban-111374 Other interesting stuff on this site about 16 bores too. Lagopus�..

It almost seems like the next book is going to be about classic steel ready autoloaders. I wonder why he chose to lobby for his knee-cap instead of coming up with some solutions for those who would like to continue using classic side by sides. I can understand the constraints of available space, but do quotes from anonymous hunters have any more weight than internet postings?

It might be somewhat of a service to expand a bit about the nameless and faceless, field sport collectives, committees, agencies and acknowledged politicians who're so effective at closing loopholes, setting the narrative, and getting everyone to fall in line.

I have Kent TM loads that I bought in the mid 2000's for about $1.80 Cdn. per shell. It costs me now over $6.00 Cdn per Kent TM shell. I suspect Americans have seen a similar, although somewhat moderated due to currency fluctuations, price rise

I'm not seeing any "rapidly dropping prices" for Tungsten and Bismuth. That kind of blatant error makes the rest of the "points" in his article suspect.

I'm also curious as to know how a voluntary ban is any different from a legal one when the result is the same. Especially when the voluntary ban comes about ONLY as a method of avoiding the legal ban. Talk about splitting hairs!

I wonder if he's a signer of the 'statement in support of lead and plastic wad removal'? There are probably chin up and smilie face solidarity clauses in it.

So is the total ban pf lead shot going to cause a fatal drop in double gun prices? Many fine doubles could be used with very expensive Bismuth shot but history in other countries show a sudden decline in shooters when a lead ban goes into effect. The common box lock doubles seem to have very weak demand already and I can�t help but wonder if the mid price range side locks won�t suffer as well. Like the decline in antique prices in the US. I�ve seen China worth 3-4K 10-15 years ago drop in value to less than 1k if you can even get a buyer. Are doubles next and how soon?

Mr. Potter laughs...and spreads his wings.


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Might be able to finally afford that DMB.

It appears that the author of the article is recommending that shooter just behave like good little sheep, and line up for the shearing.

It has been noted that the article predicts drops in prices for the inferior non-lead shotshells, which has not happened, and is unlikely to happen. We just don't see prices of things falling when demand goes up. I don't know why anyone with a brain would think it will be any different with expensive non-lead shotshells.

Unfortunately, the demand in this case is being forced down the throats of shooters who do not want the product, but will soon have no choice. Read the very last paragraph. So much for being voluntary.

As you read the article, a few things jump out. When New Zealand hunters had the choice, they chose 16 and 20 gauge guns with lead shot over the 12 gauge guns that were mandated to use inferior steel shot. That little loophole was soon slammed shut. The anti-lead folks certainly couldn't allow actual proof of their false data to remain in the fields.

We also still have the comments from anti-lead folk about how great steel shot kills. Yet those New Zealand hunters found that lead is better at longer ranges, and the shooter in Belgium found that he had to restrict his shots to around 25 yards to ensure clean kills. German shooters also experienced reduced range and more cripples. Dogs became more of a necessity to recover game which flew a long way after being hit.

So how is this possible when we are told that steel kills just as good or better than lead?

The most hopeful part was about hunters in Norway. They apparently fought back, and part of their 2005 blanket lead shot ban was reversed, so now only waterfowl shooters are stuck with it, and their older vintage guns are still useful for now.

The most effective way to lose to the anti-lead ammunition freaks is to be a sheep, and be afraid to fight back. So join the NRA, remain involved, tell your legislators that you will not support them if they support lead ammo bans, and... don't be a sheep.

Does this ban include clay shooting as well?

The article says it�s for hunting game, but it also says something about historical momentum and political disenfranchising for those who don�t have any sense.

Several countries have banned lead shot entirely it seems. One makes the sale of it entirely illegal. Once one EU nation does it others are very likely to do the same. Worse is if the EU decides it for them all then it� a done deal. Lead shot is a back door gun ownership ending tool that the anti gun people are exploiting.

I remember when we first went to steel shot here in the late 1970�s or early 1980. There was a major increase in browning 3� 20 sales. Buddy owned a gun shop and ordered 20 of them a year before the change. Back then you had to order your A5�s well in advance for the upcoming season. He got them in and had them all sold within a week. He got a premium price for them and had laid in what he thought was a years supply of 3� lead shot ammo. Half my friends were shooting those A5�s that year. And they were much better than those early steel ammo was in killing ducks.