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Joined: Dec 2009
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Wow, GF1, you must have very high taste in guns and engraving. I will still disagree with your assessment. In fact, if you still have that crude Midas or any other crude Brownings, I will begrudgingly downgrade my collection and take them off of your hands at crude prices.


Scotty
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Well, I've been looking at high grade guns for years and comparing the engraving of a Midas of other standard "high" grade Browning to a Purdey or other Brit best is unfair to the Browning as there is no comparison.And I've looked under magnification too.

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Originally Posted By: No Dak Scotty
Wow, GF1, you must have very high taste in guns and engraving. I will still disagree with your assessment. In fact, if you still have that crude Midas or any other crude Brownings, I will begrudgingly downgrade my collection and take them off of your hands at crude prices.


Thanks for that handsome offer, but they went down the road when the prices began to dramatically outpace their intrinsic value (including a European B2G and B4 that I bought overseas many years ago).

I know it's cold and lonely up there, but you should get out more...

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Does anyone have pics of these great Brit or Italian Best guns that make the classic Superposed look crude? Apparently I need to educate myself. And no lasers!!!


Scotty
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Compare a field grade superposed to a Winchester 101 of the same time period and see what crude is.Browning apparently thought they had to cover the action with engraving, regardless of how well it was done, to compete.This was pointed out in the Gun Digest when they did a side by side comparison of the 2 guns when the 101 was introduced.I much prefer the toned down engraving that they put on the field grade superlite Brownings.It was well done and set off the gun nicely.

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RHD45, we're not talking Field Grade guns on this topic, we're talking about higher grade guns. Besides, the 101 is just an exterior copy of the Superposed, matching it virtually line for line in it's shape and form since 1963, or 33 years after the Superposed set the standard for American O/Us.

The late Don Zutz said in his fine book, The Double Shotgun, that..."the Diana grade may well have been the greatest bargain ever offered American shotgunners. Superbly engraved (italics is mine) and with checkering and wood to match, its fit and finish went unquestioned."

As I look through my Schwing book, and see the incredible engraving work of Master Liege engravers like Funken, Vranken, Watrin, etc, etc, I have to laugh at anyone that would callously call these masterpieces "Crude." That is simply a laughable position. Look at pages 110-111, 118, 146, or really the whole book.

Sure, a grade 1 is simple, but that's by design. I have toured Holland and Holland, Purdey, and the Browning Custom Shop, and the high end Browning engraving is, in my opinion, just as good and certainly not crude.

I am still waiting to see pictures of these Continental guns that make the finest Browning Superposed look Crude, and NOT done in Bulino or Bank Note style. I'm talking chisel and file.

Last edited by No Dak Scotty; 12/25/14 03:32 PM.

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Well,just look at the double signed Funken in this thread. Do you really think that can be called master engraving?I'm sure Funken would even agree that his best work is far beyond that particular engraving on that gun.Not every master engraver produced a master piece every time he engrave a gun. The Browning engravers were covering a gun according to grade to meet a certain retail price point.

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Yes, that would be called a business, and it's how companies make money. Master engravers don't engrave for free. A Midas took more than 60 hours to engrave. That's why they sold for a certain price point. The mechanics of the gun are the same as the grade 1.

A grade 2 Pigeon is not a masterpiece...its a Grade 2. But it can be done by a Master, or at least signed by one, as was sometimes the case.


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I have an FN gun engraved by Funken on both sides, the recoil pad is browning...not sure why?

Just sharing the pics of my gun,cannot comment on engraving as I am no expert.














Last edited by Oberndorf; 12/28/14 09:51 PM.
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A nice "crude" engraved Browning at Holt's:

http://auctions.holtsauctioneers.com/asp...4&saletype=

Gunwolf

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