doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com RST spreader loads?

That is amazing, mike. I shoot a MX-8, with 31 1/2" fixed choke (modified) barrels in competition sporting. I have really been considering carrying some spreaders for the very close rabbits, and screaming crossers at 15 yds., for example (Wendell Cherry does this exact thing when competing). If I can get the same kind of results with my gun that you did I am definitely going to start using them for that purpose.

I've got some of Polywads spreader posts in the shop. Think I'll load up some 9s with them and pattern some for myself. What do you do, throw 7/8 oz. with the charge bar, put the post in, then top it off by hand?

SRH

I have also found Mike's trick very useful and have been using it with great results since he first posted his tests a few years back. One modification to Mike's trick that I have found very helpful with some wads is to use the 16 gauge Polywad spreader disk in my 12 gauge loads. This permits the spreader to easily fit anywhere within the wad.

That's it, Stan.

One tip is to seat the post through the wad guide; it seats squarely that way. Another is that you can make a 1/8 oz shot dipper from a 9mm cartridge case, maybe reduce the volume with a few file strokes. The real trick is to come up with the mix of components to get the right stack height and good crimps. At one time I would start with a proven 1 & 1/8 oz recipe and trim 1/8 inch off the petals of a Win or Rem 1 & 1/8 oz wad. That's the surest/quickest way for a beginner to construct a 1 oz spreader. Seems tedious, but I thought the results were well worth it. Factory spreaders have typically been loaded quite stout. I've found these loads to function fairly independently of velocity. Once I get the rhythm, I can load a box of spreaders on my 9000G in 4 minutes; a regular box is about 3 minutes.

I use a 9000G myself, so I'm ready to go. Hope my 7/8 oz. bar off my 20 ga. MEC loader will work. I'm gonna get started this afternoon on some.

When I loaded a lot, back in the "decent priced lead shot days", I got up to 700 shells an hour, pretty reliably. But, I had to keep everybody away and load completely by myself to do that.

I do not feel I need spreaders very often when competing. If the target is outside 15 yards, which the great majority are, I don't need any help. So, my reasoning is that 9s will break any target inside that distance 100% of the time. Do you agree?

SRH

Years ago, almost 40 years in fact, we use to load "spreaders" with nitro cards layered over increments of shot. Two or three 20 ga. cards spaced in the shot column of a 12 ga.. My favorite was two cards, first one about a third up the the second one at two thirds. We loaded on a 600jr, used a trimmed down .45 case to measure shot and layered shot, card, shot, card and shot over the top. I ran out of 20 cards and used 28 cards and the load got tighter or so I thought at the time. The smaller card was surrounded by shot on all sides and seemed to open the pattern up a little less.

We forget what a blessing the internet is to us these days for information, all be it a mixed one at times. In the dark days we had no source of information of "stuff" unless you had some type of book or catalog. You made phone calls or sent for catalogs trying to see what was available. A lot of what we did was by trial and error and not always very safe in hindsight. And many would not share information with others, unlike today and the "I tried this see what you think" attitude many have. It is very refreshing to see such exchange of help and information.

I wish I had it all to do over again. I do it the same way for the most part but would shoot a few less quail. I know that I personally did not cause the demise of old Bob, it was progress that wiped him out. Wild quail are gone in almost all my old hunting spots as homes have replaced roost and cover is gone. Too many retirees and not enough small farms, cut over timber and weeded fields. We use to have the most quail on farms we raised tomatoes on and those with fields in fallow with great big hedge rows. Crops today are row crops that by "law" are required to be plowed under after they are harvested leaving nothing for game to feed on over winter. Efficient farming leave nothing for the fringe feeders so game must go elsewhere or die off.

Good post, KY Jon. I am involved daily with row crop farming, so I see the problems you refer to up close. One thing that is changing, for the better, is the tendency to leave the crop residue on the surface and plant "no-till" into it the next crop. Actually, there are incentives to promote that, because of the understanding now that it is better for the water, air, and for wildlife. There really is no "law" requiring plowing under residue.

Don't feel bad about shooting quail in the good ol' days. Their decline had nothing to do with the bags you or I took. In a way, the best homage we can pay ol' Bob is to remember and cherish the good times with him in the field and around the table.

All my best, Stan

If you choose to load your own spreaders, the BPI plastic X insert does work well. They cost about three cents each.

The insert takes up the space of 1/8 oz. of shot, so use a wad with the next largest size shotcup.

For 20 gauge, I recommend trimming the X wad so it fits inside the shotcup instead of eliminating the shotcup. I've seen lead deposit in sheets when using shells with no shotcup and feel that it COULD at some point act as an obstruction and is best avoided.

They work peachy, especially for the second shot at skeet when using a choked second barrel.

All for an extra 75 sents a box.

I have posted several times about my experience with the PC Post wads, the spreading accelerated by pushing a piece of press fitted fuel line over the post to make it more aggressive and lower the capacity of the shell to one ounce. The biggest advantage is that you can prepare the wad in bulk before loading and the wad, with the fuel line addition, works through my PW just like it was a regular wad. I have tried them all, but just don't see the added result of some of the procedures and products that are so labor intensive. My PCs work just fine.

I have no problems with what a farmer is forced to do to make a living. I own three farms that I rent out. The modern farm is all about efficiency and when you have several million dollars of equipment and large outlay of money or credit you have to farm like they do today. To do otherwise would lead to failure which is in nobodies interest. And on my best day Bob was never in danger of me shooting him to near extinction hereabouts.

Farming today is so dependent on pesticides and insecticide, mono crops or three total crops a year on a farm that edge cover and insects for young birds are gone. No home, no dinner equals no birds. While farm land is no longer home to Bob he can be found else where if you manage him well.

We do manage to get decent numbers of quail in cut over timber for three to four years, but see no long term increase unless you cut timber in rotation, which my timber land is too small to do. But a few coveys have been kept going for over a dozen years in cut over / replanted timber.

I save these birds for a young hunter who has his first dog and as seed for hope. The kid follows a strict agreement to harvest birds until the covey hits six birds and then stops hunting them for the year. He can use them to train his dog but six is the number we have found that will let that covey recover and breed next year. Six leaves a few for natural predators and with luck a pair or two to breed. So in this way he can have his own memories of the good old days.

He is the second young hunter to be allowed to manage the quail population on the farms. Some years one or more farm has nothing to manage. And he knows those woods like the back of his hand and worries about 'his' birds like a true sportsman does. I just wish he would use a nice double. He calls my interest in doubles "odd" which is a reflection of something his mother might think about me. But that is a another story or perhaps he/she is right.

Shotgunjones; I use the BPI also. Just recently I got the insert into a RST 2 1/2" 16ga 1oz load recipe using the SG16 wad which it called for and it pie crimped nicely after I pre-squished the wad before the insert, but it came back up to within 1/16" of where it was. You have to wiggle the insert a little to get it in. It gives better distribution of shot than the Polywad but doesn't spread quite as much.

Using the same recipe with 15/16 oz in one of my Elsies, which is the only one I was patterning, gave a 22" effective pattern out of a barrel that gave 17" non-spreader. The choke was .025.