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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 119
Sidelock
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Sidelock

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 119
Greetings all,

I noticed a comment that Kirby Hoyt made regarding one of the guns on his site which really has my interest peaked! He mentions that the lines on the bottom of an action are not scratches but are forging marks which often appear on guns more than 100 years old. See here - http://www.vintagedoubles.com/catalog/?sort=2&process=fullview&gunID=2236
I have never heard this before but it would make sense as you often tend to see these marks on older hammerguns with smooth action bottoms.

The picture below is from a gun built in 1899 and I had assumed that these similar lines were scratches, but they dont really look like scratches upon close inspection. It would solve a puzzling question if this is indeed the case.
Can anyone verify this? Somehow, I have never heard or seen any mention of this before.

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 13,879
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 13,879
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BG,
I've seen cracks, voids, inclusions, and various discolorations in forgings. A lot of stuff is possible. But looking at that picture isn't enough for me to be able to figure out what it is. They just look like scratches to me.

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 119
Sidelock
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Sidelock

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 119
Hi Chuck,

I will try to take a macro of the bottom of the action and perhaps that will help determine what the lines are.

Joined: Feb 2009
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Joined: Feb 2009
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Could those in the picture be scratches after all. They seem to have a similar color as the engraving. Interesting.

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 161
cgs Offline
Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 161
Absolutely correct and that is what they look like in the picture above. They are quite commonly seen on early Winchester lever actions as well. Knowledgeable collectors usually request that they be preserved when restoring. Commonly mistaken as scratches.

Best, Dan

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 175
Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 175
I agree with cgs. Having collected older 94 Winchesters the lines are seen quite often. I have picked up a few at a discount because of them. They are correct from my HUMBLE point of view.


BEWARE OF DOGMA
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,264
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,264
Likes: 196
Early in my collecting career I traded for an early Parker 20 ga. One of the earliest Parker VH 20s. It's frame had those lines and I thought the gun might be defective. That was when $800 was a lot of money for a gun like that.

Joined: Feb 2004
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Sidelock
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Joined: Feb 2004
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It'd be interesting to do some NDI on guns with these. I wonder if they're "coldlaps" .

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 272
Sidelock
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 272
All of my Model 1893 Marlins had lines like that, too.


GMC(SW) - USN, Retired (1978-2001)


Joined: May 2010
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
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Joined: May 2010
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Grain lines in the metal from the original forging . You see a lot in wrought iron work .Not a lot you can do about them with out polishing them out and by that I mean file rather than mop. Even then there is a percentage that will probably always show .
All old ladies have wrinkle or two .

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