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#275626 04/19/12 02:41 PM
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There is a model 12 I may have an opportunity to buy. The receiver was engraved and I suspect when it was blued, it was done at the wrong temperature as the finish has that purple color.

My question is, can this be redone with the correct blue color or has the damage been done?

Regards,

Max

max #275634 04/19/12 03:50 PM
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Max:
There is no damage other than simple bodgery. I assume there's no buffing issues to deal with, so Simmons can fix you up with no problem.

Last edited by Kensal Rise; 04/19/12 03:52 PM.
max #275636 04/19/12 04:28 PM
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The plum color could be there for numerous reasons. Sometimes the alloy of the steel can be the culprit with the hot bluing coming out purple, or another factor is the bluing solution was well used and needed to be changed. I've seen many "fine" guns that started out having a nice black finish, turn that purple color years later. Many factors involved.

Dustin

max #275639 04/19/12 04:37 PM
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I agree with Kensal on the buffing issues, and I'd certainly factor in the cost of refinishing into the price. But I'm not certain of the bodgery part. I've never tried hot bluing, but I've read that steels with a high nickel content can turn purple after bluing. I have a Mauser model 66S with .30-06 and .243 barrels in as new condition that has never been reblued, and the receiver has turned purplish. The rest of the blued steel is a very deep blue black, and I assume it did not leave the Mauser factory with a purple receiver. The original owner who I bought it from told me it changed color while in storage, and thought it might have something to do with the Clenzoil he wiped it down with. I seriously doubt that Clenzoil had anything to do with it.


A true sign of mental illness is any gun owner who would vote for an Anti-Gunner like Joe Biden.

max #275640 04/19/12 04:42 PM
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You're correct...Clenzoil had nothing to do with it. I'm no metallurgy expert, but I have friends in the gun making business that believe the silicone content of the steel being blued has alot to do with the bluing turning a purple/plum color over time.

Dustin

max #275649 04/19/12 06:21 PM
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Keith:
The purple is mostly due to the fact that M-12s are made with nickel steel frames. If the "gunsmith/bluer" doesn't know this, and does not approach the finish properly (like Simmons will) he has no business bluing guns. Call the fellow what you will.

max #275652 04/19/12 06:50 PM
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Max... Winchester is/was famous for their plum color. Your model 12 probably is factory standard. Get involved in collecting Model 94s and Model 12s like I do, and you will discover literally dozens of guns with the standard factory "plum" bluing.............. Grant.
P.S. If the bluing is in good condition, I wouldn't have it redone.....

max #275722 04/20/12 02:22 PM
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For what it's worth. A fine rust blue will work, and will not change with age.

max #275733 04/20/12 05:14 PM
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Kensal, I understand what you are saying. If I recall correctly, the salts bath is run at a higher temp in order to blue nickel steel parts without getting reds or purples. Don't quote me on that though. But it sounds as though some guns that were originally blue can turn purple over time. As with my Mauser M66S, I assume the Winchester guns that turn purple were not purple when they left the factory. If that's true, isn't it possible that a Simmons re-blue could also change color over time? I have never read an explanation for why this color change occurs or if it can be prevented.


A true sign of mental illness is any gun owner who would vote for an Anti-Gunner like Joe Biden.

max #275738 04/20/12 06:20 PM
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I have never seen a Winchester model 12 nickel steel gun that Simmons blued turn purple over time. There is a technique of salts/temperatures that results in a black that lasts. Not too many people know how to do that anymore. Different alloys used in different gun parts need different times and temperatures to come out black and stay black. A lot of guns and parts present bluing problems.
And as stated, a rust blue will not turn colors, at least as far as I have ever seen.


Dennis Potter
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