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Forums10
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Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,071
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,071 |
From the way I understand it, the selling dealer took the metal out of the bores. He had the gun for a cleaning and going over at Turbulls and asked them to measure barrel wall thickness. From what I gather, they gave him the measurements but did not do the actual pitt removing. But still, they insist that the gun is safe. This is the way I understand the story. However, one must tread with caution because in Turbulls defence, we really don't know the full story of what took place and what was said.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,733 Likes: 492
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,733 Likes: 492 |
Are you saying that Turnbulls is telling you that a gun with a wall of .018 9" ahead of the chamber is safe to shoot? I would love to have them put that in writing. Ten to one they will refuse to do it. That area should me nearer .035 plus, not a paper thin .018. Four of your favorite fingers and one of your favorite thumbs rest about 9" past the chambers.
Go measure 20 doubles and you will not find one other with that thin wall in that area. Maybe find one 9" from the chokes but not near the chambers. When you hear of doubles passing proof at .020 wall thickness they are talking about near the muzzle being .020 not right in front of the chambers. Then the concern is the thin metal can be dented very easily. Ask one of the British dealers if they would submit that gun for proof? None would, they would first have it sleeved.
It is your gun and your fingers. Please consider that the margin for error or your safety margin is razor thin. In fact the thickness of a single edge razor is just .009. About half that of your barrels. Look at two razor blade stacked on each other and see if that is thick enough for your peace of mind. Sleeve it or send it back to the dealer and have them resell it or buy it back. Pass on this gun it is not worth the risk.
Last edited by KY Jon; 09/17/11 11:52 AM.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
This is from the 1890's. The pressures then were the equivalent of the RST shells. So, who ever is saying RST is safe in your barrels is not competent.
 This is a burst barrel caused by an obstruction. Please take a good look at the middle finger.
I and many others here shoot damascus barrels.
Almost everyone here shoots vintage guns.
Most all have the common sense to not play Russian Roulette.
If you want the barrels measured again, just say so.
There are many here who have the equipment and willingness to help.
Ask who ever measures the barrels to provide a written chart for each tube.
The best advice so far is to have full length Briley tubes made up in my opinion.
Sleeving the gun will be very expensive.
Pete
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,964 Likes: 89
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,964 Likes: 89 |
It is your gun and your fingers. Please consider that the margin for error or your safety margin is razor thin. In fact the thickness of a single edge razor is just .009. About half that of your barrels. Look at two razor blade stacked on each other and see if that is thick enough for your peace of mind. Sleeve it or send it back to the dealer and have them resell it or buy it back. Pass on this gun it is not worth the risk. Ky Jon, seems to me now that the gun has been determined to be very unsafe (landmine), it would be totally irresponsible to try to pass it on to some unsusupecting shooter. It ought to be handled same as a gun in England that fails proof--condemned. To sell it would be very close to blood money. I agree the dealer should take it back....but you know what he's going to do with it......
When an old man dies a library burns to the ground. (Old African proverb)
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,733 Likes: 492
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 7,733 Likes: 492 |
I agree that the gun should not be sold as a shooter. I am not for selling this gun "as is" unless the buyer is informed that it is too thin to shoot. I also do not think the current owner should take the loss. The seller ruined the barrels and should stand behind it. If it takes you a day, week or even a year to find out that the seller hacked the gun it makes no difference in my mind. They should have known that the gun was a time bomb and never sold it in the first place. If the barrels are .018 thick and the seller did the work and then sold the gun knowing that they were paper thin then they are not a dealer to be trusted in any way.
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 32
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 32 |
Doug Turnbull said the right barrel was measured three times. Thing is - I put over 100 rounds of RST Lite 1 oz. at 6800 PSI through that barrel after I bought it at G&H before I sent it to Doug for inspection and cleaning. Doug's shop provided the surprising thickness measurements. I requested measurements from G&H when they removed the pits I noticed. I was told they didn't have the barrel measurements handy but I was assured it was safe to use with low pressure RST ammo. I sent a note to their gunsmith regarding the thickness issue and haven't heard back.
I researched the Teague option and read one bad review about "bubbles" showing after the process was completed. There was some discussion that the barrel(s) walls may have been drilled out completely in one area and the lining adhesive was visible. I spoke with Gary at Briley and will probably have it sleeved by them. Cost for one barrel is 1300.00 and for both it's around 1730.00.
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 32
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 32 |
Hi PeteM -
You stated the barrel split was caused by an obstruction - that could blow up any gun. Can you provide gunsmith(s) contact info that can provide barrel measurements and chart?
Thanks,
Joey
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743 |
Do we have a pressure curve for the RSTs. Just because a load has lower max chamber pressure does no necessarily mean it is lower at the 9" popint, in fact it could well be higher. To obtain equal velocity with a given amount of shot requires equal work be done. If its doing less at opne point it has to make up for it somewhere else.
Miller/TN
I Didn't Say Everything I Said, Yogi Berra
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
Hi All -
Last year I purchased a beautiful vintage Prussian 16 bore SxS from a reputable gun dealer. I noticed a small amount of pitting and had their gunsmith polish the barrels. I was told the right barrel had slightly deeper pits so more metal was lost but wall thickness remained within limits and the gun was safe to use with my favorite low pressure RST 2 1/2 shells.
Could we see pictures of this beautiful vintage Prussian 16 bore that you are about to get even further upside down in.
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