doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com RBLs Again

Tracy,

Then we agree, 6# 8Oz is a light twelve. I think if you review the entire topic you would have to agree that a 7# 12 Ga RBL is certainly light(er) than the 8# to 10# guns.

With the exeption of the Sauer, (maybe) it may not be a great idea to feed any of your guns listed a steady diet of say 1 1/4 Oz Nitro Pheasants or similar ammo. Set your Sauer up with the CSMC interchangeable pad system and create a 7# er!

Back to the light(er) twelve Ga. RBL. There are a few light RBL 16's. These guns were ordered as a game gun with SG/SFE/HRBP and will weigh from the lightest to the heaviest I am aware of, 6# 2 Oz, to 6# 10 Oz. Other heavier 16's were ordered with EW/PG/BTFE/Pad system. These guns will be at 6# 14Oz to 7# 5 Oz. from what I have deduced. Small wonder that they are heavy. If you order a trap gun that is what you should expect! Now let's presume that CSMC would provide a set of 12 Ga barrels for the 16 Ga frame, (obviously they have made them). The result should be a light twelve in the 6# 8 Oz range with 26" barrels, SG/SFE/HRBP. A gun that you can feed whatever is available, steel, lead, no-tox.

I have owned a few guns like you have listed. Most notably a 16 Ga W&C Scott. Slim wristed, light, a very nice little 20 GAUGE!!

In the end there isn't a right or wrong here. Buy what you like and use it in good health.

Chief

Gentlemen,

Sorry for the delay but my 5-day old metal hip hasn't learned to climb the stairs to the vault very well...

I did not have my best gauge available but these measurements should be very close.

Heavy 32" RBL 12:
-Firing Pin Centers: 1.159"
-Breach Balls: 2.312"

Light 32" "Special Order" RBL 12:
-Firing Pin Centers: 1.079"
-Breach Balls: 2.157"

Differences:
-Firing Pin Centers: .080"
-Breach Balls: 1.55"

It appears that my Light 32" RBL 12 was built on a 16 Gauge frame. When I received that gun I called Adam of CSMC to thank him. I asked him how he managed to build such a light gun? He responded, "It was a lot of work." Since CSMC reportedly spends but a one hour hand labor on manufacturing RBLs I doubt they made any profit on this special order gun! Perhaps the only reason Adam would accept a special order (at no additional cost to me) was that when previously the rib seperated on my Heavy RBL 12, I was most polite to him acknowledging that in manufacturing any new product, "stuff happens". Had I been a butthead demanding it be repaired in a week he may not have thought well of me. Treating people respectfully (as we wish to be treated) is something I that over the years that I have learned to do. In this case I believe my good manners brought me a free assisted opener (see my previous post) for my Heavy RBL 12 and CSMC accepting a special order for a Light 32" RBL for which I highly doubt they made any profit on.

As an old friend from Macon Georgia advised me years ago, "Good manner will take you far!"

Respectfully,
Mark

The RBL's strike me as being heavy for a walking field gun, I do not want to carry a 7lb + gun while walking behind a dog. In my world I want a 12ga no more than 6.5lb and a smaller gauge should be lighter. I do not understand why anyone would want a smaller gauge gun that weighs more than a 12.
Note my comments above are for walking field guns. I do own some heavier 12ga SXS guns for high volume dove shooting, sporting clays etc but I think they will all top out at about 8lb.
Here is a description of a gun I recently had made for myself by Verney-Carron.

12ga 2 3/4" chambers
Steel shot proof barrels
30" barrels
Screw in chokes
6lb 6oz
round body action (action at the hinge pin ....1.5 wide, .75 deep, 6.5" diameter around the barrels)
bottom rib left off to save weight
classic style swamped game rib
Hand checkered, hand engraved
ejectors
Skeleton butt plate, so that a recoil pad would not drag when bringing the gun up.
Lock up is the same 6 lugs that V-C uses on the big Nitro double rifles

Ken, what's the street price on The V-C ? Is this built to your specs or a production gun. Any idea what a 20ga may weigh? Where can I handle one? Photos???

To add in my two cents worth as I am the owner of a 16 gauge RBL (straight grip and splinter), I will say that I am very pleased with this shotgun. It is now my main choice for pheasant hunting and has performed really well in the field. My gun weighs with the shorter of the two supplied recoil pads 6 lbs. 10 oz. and I find this weight is very good for balance and carrying. The thicker pad adds 3 oz. and would be my choice for using the RBL for trap shooting. All in all I think I made a real smart choice when I ordered this shotgun; I'd recommend these guns highly.

I dare say the vast majority of American hunters have carried seven pound and heavier 12-gauge guns while following bird dogs after prairie grouse and pheasants since the end of the Northern War of Aggression. How many 12-gauge Parker Bros.; Ithaca doubles; A.H. Fox; L.C. Smiths; Stevens; Bakers; Winchester Model 97, 12, and 21s; Remington Model 1894, 1900, 10, 11, Sportsman, 29, 31, etc. etc. weigh less than seven pounds?

It appears some have missed the point ken/kebco made. Yeah, most those 12ga. American classics were indeed over 7 lbs., but who in the world wants to lug those beasts around all day, Paul Bunyan?

I only said the guns were heavy, I personally would never buy a 16 that weighs more than many 12ga guns. For me a 16 should weigh less than 6.5lb and closer to 6. I settled on a 12 for availability of ammo and wanted barrels safe for steel if that was all I could find or was required to use

This is why I no longer hunt with any of the above, had at one time or another 12ga 21's, Parkers, Lefevers, LC's, Fox's, and although there is a romance with hunting with a American classic there are better choices for me.
I try not to hunt with pumps and auto's (except waterfowl and turkeys) and will not allow them in any photo's.

They are made to order, start about $9K depending on options. You can spec the weight, I have seen a 20 well under 6lb.
V-C will be at Dallas Safari Club and SCI/Reno in Jan 2011.
I have a hard time with photo posting, I can however email photos