doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Mike Orlan --- please respond.

How about that? You must have missed my post, way back, that admitted that my comment about barrel rapists' character was tongue in cheek. Recognition of sarcasm and humor is a bit hit and miss on these sites.

Apologies are in order,then. Sorry, I didn't see it, and let my emotions get the best of me. I knew it was the wrong thing to do when I sent it. I really don't have a horse in this race anyhow.
Sincerely
Rick

8BORE, my apologies also. I read it at face value and it touched the same nerve that's being short circuited by all the Washington nonsense. Randy

I do have an agenda beyond soliciting apologies. Like some like minded participants on Dave's site, I wish people would spend their barrel raping money on shells. Learn to shoot your tight bored guns and reduce your supposed recoil by shooting lighter loads rather than drilling out the forcing cones. A very good friend is wondering how to put the choke back into his NID 5E Trap that he had removed several years ago. Somehow, I have survived fifty years of owning over four hundred shotguns without modifying the chokes or forcing cones on one. I'm sorry about Mr. Orlen and his situation, but this too will pass.

I agree fully. The worst thing that ever happened to the shotgun is the choke. The second worse thing that ever happened was the idea that you could modify a choke.

The truth of the matter is...if you missed a shot it's because you didn't shoot too good, not because you had the wrong choke.

Bill, I agree with you 100%. How many people come on here with a new purchased sxs and have never fired it, want to open up the chokes, open up the forcng cones and put a recoil pad on it.
Like you stated learn to shoot it with the proper shells and you won't have to do any of the above mentioned things.

Of course if the stock is short than something has to be done.

I've seen several guns, my Tobin included, that featured forcing "steps", not cones at all. The gun was produced somewhat early in the last century, and, whoever ordered it must not have read Frank Major Tobins report and opinion that most shooters would be better off with minimal choke in their gun, since it had about .039 and .045 constrictions in the 28 inch barrels. Maybe it was a duck gun in a former life? A 16 gauge duck gun?
Well, it isn't now. The original pistol grip stock of ho-hum walnut featured 3 1/2" of luscious drop, perfect for all you 4' neanderthals out there, but, useless for me. Whoever thinks you can hunt early season grouse in western WI or eastern MN with chokes or a stock like that, I'm going to guess hasn't done it.
Things change. Our powder isn't an explosive anymore, plastic shot cups came along, and those two things alone eliminated the need for most forms of choke. Pattern testing before and after with my old gun revealed a startling difference, plus, the ends weren't ripped off the fired rounds, leaving jagged plastic hulls suitable only for loading 2" 16 gauge ammunition.
My late Father had a fasination with gee-gaw plastic shotgun sights, likely brought about by Marine Corps training that gave him proficiency with his rifle far beyond what is typical for foot soldiers. I didn't share it, and just quietly removed them when he didn't need his guns anymore.
Would I modify the Tobin again? Absolutely. It wasn't Roosevelt's gun, after all. It didn't go to Africa in a documented safary of some sort.
Most of them don't. A lot of people don't seem to realize that, however.
It's a gun. Shoot it. Your history and memories should be more important to you then some gun's history.
Best,
Ted

8BORE, So your comments were not tongue in cheek !!! Your intent was to look down on those of us who you accuse of having no respect for our vintage guns. I see!! If I had a trainload of SXS's like you, I could probably find a few with the proper chokes and fit. Buying shells and more practice?? Hitting a woodcock or grouse with an xtra full choked Sterlingworth and watch the feathers float to the ground seems to be a waste, but it would reveal excellent marksmanship. Have you shared your thoughts with Ken Hurst regarding his engraving on those treasured field grades? I agree, what a shame. Just a thought, but maybe your way of thinking has convinced Mike to stockpile all the barrels he's received for choke work and put them in protective custody. That would keep us butcher's from doing things that big brother sees as unconscionable. I assume broken parts such as firing pins and hammersprings should be left as is seeing it's just part of the life cycle of the vintage gun. Yep, hit the nerve again. Thanks for clarifying your tongue and cheek comment, I get it now. This is probably a petty issue and small in the scheme of things, but your comments as trite as it may seem, lightly challenge my right of free choice and freedom, thus prompting my overbearing reply. Hunter/Gatherer

Gee...and I just checked in on this thread to see if Ken ever did get in touch with Mike Orlen.

I guess I will just have to give him a call to find out.

Ok guys, there goes the bell for round 3 LOL

Randy, I can see the profile of your tongue-in-cheekness, but I don't think Orlen is/was/will be worried by barrel rapine defined as long cones. The old "Choke and Chamber Music" site had a sidebar on the benefits of the revision of short cones.

jack