Hello, I'm interested in buying a Drilling and hoped to find one in 16 GA or 20 GA and a usable deer caliber, I live in the North East so about any rifle cartridge should work fine. I do reload but not the out dated older stuff. I was hoping someone could point me in the right direction as these guns range in price all over and I know very little about them.
This one that I'm looking at http://griffinhowe.com/othermoreinfo.cfm and http://griffinhowe.com/othermoreinfo.cfm


Thanks for the help Bob

Bob, they seemed a bit overpriced.

If you shop, you'll find a very good drilling in the $2500 to $4500 price range.

These are just my opinions, but here is what I think is a "good drilling".

You only want a 16 gauge, they are light weight and most common. 12 gauge are too clumsy and weigh too much. 20 gauge guns are much rarer and the price will be higher.

You want a gun in one of these three calibers so you can buy good ready made ammo: 8x57 JR, 8x57 JRS or 9.3x72r. All functional for boar, deer, and black bear.

If you choose a 16ga gun with a rifle in the above options, you also want 27" barrels. This configuration makes for a 7 pound gun that handles like a well made shotgun, not like a heavy boat oar.

Of all the guns on that list, I like the cheapest one best!

Carl Bock - Drilling - 16 ga. - $1,200.00
Item Number: FWK18359

If the bores are good, it would take well to full restoration. Beauty in its simplicity and it has all the right features in my opinion.

Thanks Rookhawk, that's the info I was looking for. Is 27" barrels a mininmum or just desirable.
Cheers Bob

What is 9.3x72R similar too, 45-70?
Bob

9.3X72R is some what similar to a 38-55

Bob,

27" drillings in 16 gauge are of a weight and proportion that they handle very much likes quality double barrel shotgun. If perceived weight, swing, and speed of acquisition are important to you, the aforementioned drilling will come close.

On the other hand, usually 12 gauge drillings are 24" barreled and they don't feel at all like shotguns. They feel like boat oars to me. It's an awkward handling sensation if you shoot shotguns often for a point of reference.

http://www.martiniandhagngunmakers.com/forsale_combination.htm

There's a few listed here. I made a deposit on the 16 by 7x65R - a nice light gun with a reasonable rifle cartridge.

12 gauge "clumsy" auf eine drie schrottenflinten mit ein gewjeren lauf?? I beg to differ. Old "Fetter Junge" Herman Goring selected 12 gauge Krieghoff Drillings- German worden-Drie- three- for his beloved Luftwaffe survival gun kits for his pilots- only a few have surfaced- I have seen and handled one (and translated the Feldbuch that comes in the aluminum case with separate parachute rig) for its new owner- beautiful. Old Herman was a major league gun and art collector- you can bet your last Strudel that he got the very first one made- and probably shot it at Karinhall--

AFAIK the Luftwaffe Drilling was made by Sauer, not Krieghoff.

With kind regards,
Jani

By far the most common usable rifle caliber in a drilling is 8X57JR. It uses .318 bullets but you can load your own or just buy S&B loaded ammo. Also you'll find that 16 gauges predominate. If you can find a drilling with nitro proof and 70mm chambers life is easier, but I would never turn down a 65mm gun, as RST and others make dandy ammo. I have both 12GA and 16GA drillings, and the 16s are much handier and lighter than the 12s. 12GA drillings predominate in postwar guns, as most of them are used primarily for shooting driven game with slugs and buckshot backing the rifle barrel. Nowadays the right shotgun barrel is often fitted with a rifle caliber insert to produce a double rifle drilling. Again this is for driven large game, not small game hunting. While the 9.3X72 is a common drilling caliber in older guns, the only ammo maker now is probably S&B and the round is anemic compared to the 8X57JR. I would not stick to a particular barrel length, but rather look for a gun that handles like a shotgun if your aim is to use it for small game with a rifle backup. Try to find a drilling that does not use a Greener side safe but rather has a safety on the top tang. The Germans love Greener safes but they are hard to get used to when you are familiar with a tang safety. If you buy a drilling without a scope, figure $1500 to install one. Claw mounts are nice but the EAW swing mounts are as nice and much less expensive. If you find a drilling with claw mount bases but no scope, there is a conversion kit that will permit the claw mount bases to be converted to a swing mount. NECG and Kreighoff USA are two sources of drilling components and supplies.

Welcome opinions on this one.
EMIL KERNER, Drilling, BLNE, 16 GA / 8x57jr, 27'', F& F, DT, Pistol Grip, Splinter Forearm, Full length rib, Gray Receiver, Relief Game Scene Engraving, Cartridge trap, Claw mount bases, Set rigger, Horn Gaurd & grip cap, Greener style safety, Cocking indicators, Sling Swivels, Barrels re-blued, Dimensions 1 3/8 x 2 5/8 x 14 1/2, Weight 7#3oz, ID 3137, VG Condition $2495
Thanks all for replies Bob

Bob,

I like most of that. To be perfect, this is what would differ:

1. You'd rechoke or it would come choked IC or Mod in right barrel
2. It would not have a horn trigger guard
3. It would not have claw bases unless it came with a scope. (to get new base and rings fitted is an $800 job!)
4. If possible 8x57jrs is preferred for additional power and modern ammo availability.

If you don't want to reload ammo for it,this guy makes just about anything you want (I had him make some 8X57R360 for Cape for instance).

http://www.safariarms.com/

You can also try this guy for claw mounts.

http://www.clawmounts.com/

RWTF,

I don't mean to be at all argumentative with my statement, I was just giving my own opinion. Your example however, supports my statement precisely. I suggested the gentleman get a 16 gauge drilling because they stand a higher chance of handling like a shotgun and that they can be found with 27" barrels. The luftwaffe drilling you speak of in 12 gauge is a survival gun and it had 24" 12 gauge barrels. Just what someone would want if they were literally stuck on a desert island but not a particularly light and elegant gun, nor one that would really handle like a modern shotgun.

12 gauge drillings abound and they are lovely guns for their intended European purposes. (I think they call that type of hunting form "Jagged-something"?) They were never engineered to be upland game guns with light chokes and a graceful swing. They were classic, 24" barreled "buck and ball" guns designed to provide a shot for hares, roe deer, boar and larger game. They were built to be rifles and they handle accordingly.

Just my opinion but I think I'd welcome your counterpoint as would the gentleman taking in all views as he tries to find his first drilling.

Respectfully,

Rookhawk

If this one is as advertised, it would be worth looking into in my opinion. I would make a run at it if I were not a little over capicity in Drillings currently.



http://www.gunsinternational.com/Three-B...un_id=100133950

The Sauer Model 30s for the Luftwaffe(12/65) were 650mm as far as I know. Also the concept/overall design intent for the drilling was based on the 16 bore and any dimensions outside of that gets into a more complicated design.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Chiming in a bit late on this one...
Labowner, do you own a bird dog?
Reason being, love my drillings and capes but from what I have learned, Germany was/is not the place for wingshooting so most of those drillings were made to shoot things from a high stand with the shotgun reserved for smaller furred varients mainly hare, fox, etc. That should explain the way that most of them are stocked. Even as a shotgun they were more like a rifle.
Now the dog issue. Given the choice I have found that without going to a dural frame, the lightest (most shotgun like) drillings are the hammer guns. A rifle is a rifle unless you are driving deer so the hammers shouldn't matter.
I don't know about you, but shooting birds without a dog present is difficult enough without having to deal with cocking hammers - hence shooting over a pointer with a hammer gun really isn't any issue.
I have a blitz action Meffert that is a fantastic rifle in 7x57r but as a 7.75# 16 ga it has something to be desired.

The solution of course is to purchase two drillings - a hammer and a blitz action. Oh, and of course a pointer if you don't already have one.

Cheers

Tom

The weight of the drilling depends on more variables than just the guage. The quality of the steel can make it possible to build the gun lighter and be just as strong--witness my Funk 12 ga. with bohler antinit steel and practically a 20 guage frame. Another option for "light" is an alloy or duraluminum frame. There are many variables in the bore size of the 9.3x72R. I like it, but it can be a serious reloading proposition. I think a test firing is mandatory before the purchase is considered settled. I have had a number of drillings that needed work or reregulation because: 1. the left barrel pattern crossed at 30 yards (3 drillings had that problem--the right barrel was just fine), 2. both barrels crossed at 25 yds., 3. the rifle would not consistently fire, 4. the older german scope would not adjust, etc. You get my drift. Be sure you can check it out. I have seen but not experienced a rifle barrel unsoldered at the muzzle, loose ribs, barrel pitting, etc. Take a good look at them, and by all means check them out at the range. Beware of empty claw mounts--they are expensive to replace. Beware of existing claw mount--they are not always tight. Swing mounts may be less problematic. A good drilling is a true joy--a bad one is a heap of trouble. Paying a little more for a Sauer 3000, or Kreighoff, or Hymn, or...is a lot better than buying two or three junkers wishing they would be your dream gun. It is hard to go wrong with 8x57, 7x57, 7x65, 9.3x74 and other RIMMED cartridges. Not saying a Sauer 3000 in 30-06 isn't great, but it means extraction is subject to chamber cleanliness, extractor tab and spring in good working order, etc. A shorter barrel is not always a boat oar. Longer barrels will weigh more, especially if they are made of older steels. Newer steels and receivers are probably best for slug use, as well as higher caliber insert barrels. I have found 25 1/2 inch barrels (65cm) to be just fine. Good luck! Steve

Steve,
A lot of Drilling wisdom in your post.

With kind regards,
Jani

Thanks all for the great info, I'll take my time and keep looking and maybe Otto my 7 month Deutsch Drahthaar will hunt with one next year.
Cheers Bob

That explains everything

The man has a dd, (crafty move with the "Labowner" handle)

Good luck in your search Bob - and with Otto.

Tom

I have not found my Drilling yet but do have a hold on this one. Item number 2755689 at Cabela's gun libary

I have two hammer guns so this will not be totally new to me. The tag has the caliber as 8.8 x 72.
Welcome any comments.
Cheers Bob

The 8.8 is the bore size. It'll be a 9.3X72R caliber.

That is a common and available caliber? Would I be able to shoot standard ammo in this gun?

Labowner
Ammo is available from J&G Sales. As to whether you can shoot standard ammo-see the thread "9.3x72R?....." in the German and Austrian Guns Forum.Especially read Axel's comments.For whatever it's worth, I have been using drillings 50+ years and much prefer 16ga with 60-65 cm barrels in any of the 57mm long calibers. 9.3x74 and 7&8x65R as well as 8&8sx60R are great. 9.3x72R, 8x57R/360,8x58R are acceptable, but 6.5x58R,5.6x52R,etc- I would want in a second or third drilling-not the main one.If you intend to hunt with it, a scope is very important, a 22/22mag insert barrel is useful but not necessary. Be sure to either inspect it before buying it or get the right to return it within a reasonable period.Check very carefully for loose comming ribs and badly fitting stock(oil soaked/rotten).30-06 is a wonderful caliber, but I absolutely do not want it in a drilling,or any other rimless cartridge for that matter.
Mike

Thanks all, did any one look at gun if so what your opinion.

Looks like a nicely redone snap action drilling with a fair price if it checks out good & that is what you like, that is one nice feature in dealing with Cabelas is that you can have it shipped to your local store for your Inspection before you make a firm commitment, which is really important with firearms that have been around a hundred years or more

m-4

The Gun Digest 1955 article “Proof in Modern Germany”, by Baron von Engelhart states: “The very commonly used 9,3x72 (now called 9,3x72R), frequently was marked as 8,7 and similar”. Evidently "similar" can include 8,7; 8,75 or 8,8mm. A chamber cast is, of course, a sensible precaution.