Would any of the active upland hunters here have an opinion on the maximum weight they advise in a SXS or O/U 28ga. field gun?

I'm not interested in hearing about 12ga skeet guns with 28ga tubes....

My FAIR Verona 30" barreled 28 gauge weighs 7/3.8, unloaded. It's plenty fast enough for me on quail and woodcock. I wouldn't want it much heavier, and a few ounces lighter wouldn't be a problem, either. Good balance/handling belies a few extra ounces, IMO.

My Webley 600 with 30" barrels weighs 6 lbs 13 oz. I can't understand how 28 gauges can be so heavy...

HB

My 16ga Ory and Duqueene and 28ga WC Scott are both sub 6 lbs. Unless its a dedicated Pheasant gun, I wouldn't consider anything over 6lbs 2 oz for all day carry in the woods. If Im in thick cover, the 28ga with short barrels and a balance point a little further back is best for one hand carry.
In contrast, my hunting partner shoots a 20ga Ruger O/U at 7 lbs even, with 28" barrels, and says it miserable in the thick cover. He's "downsizing" for next season, both in weight and barrel length.

If you are talking about one all around gun that includes pheasants, I would be looking at 6lbs 2oz to 6 lbs 5 oz with 28" barrels as a compromise.

JMO
Hope this helps.

Over and under guns tend to be heavier than a side-by-side , such as your Webley, of similar bore.

Quite a few 28 bore over and unders are built on 20 bore frames.

5 !/2 lbs. Bobby

What Bobby said. Or less.
Same for 20s.
5.75 # for 16s
6 # for 12s.

There really is no good reason to carry a ton of bricks, though you certainly can. If you do (and I do frequently) then why not make it a 12? They are far more versatile.

I have 28 G. SKB 200 HR that is easy to carry at 6.5 lbs. It also has screw chokes to meet the shooting needs of the day.

Mine's 5 1/4 lbs, but it's built on a .410 frame. I'm with Bobby on this one, 5 1/2 lbs in a side by side is about right. Many 28s are built on a 20 frame and will be heavier. Brent's on the right path, except I don't mind a 6.5 lb 12. Over/unders do tend to be heavier in the same gauge because they are more target guns than game guns.

My (now sold) AYA 4/53 28 gauge with 29 inch barrels weighed 6 pounds exactly. It was extremely well balanced and very quick to mount. (Parenthetically, I was stupid to have sold it and wish I had sold the Guerini 28 gauge instead when I was raising the funds to purchase my SIACE Concordia 28 gauge.)

A slim 28g gun swings better for me at 6 lbs. I couldn't hit anything with my Uggie or AYA, both around 5.5#. I now have a Parker Repro at 6.0 # and shoot much better. FWIW.

Galazan Fox
Sub 6 lb
28" or 30", BTFE or SFE

More than weight, fit is critical for any shotgun, and barrel length in lighter guns is almost as critical as well (at least for me). My Dickenson has adult dimensions and 28-inch tubes (& i'm thinking 30 would be even better). I'd love to see a discussion on sub-gage guns here, with the advantages and disadvantages laid out very clearly. I'm a big 12 bore fan because of its lethality, anything less IMHO is a compromise on that lethality but....weight (when carried all day) is a significant factor in upland performance by the hunter as well. For years now, I've found the 16 to be arguably the best compromise in weight vrs lethality in the uplands, but from using my little 28 for the last 2-years, I'm seeing good results there too. Ballistically, I see the 28 as being comparable to the 20, but with lots of weight advantages over the 20 (in both the guns and the weight of the ammo you carry).

That seems a bit much for a 28 bore.

Top German gun is 24 bore but with 28ga inserts. Weight 5-8oz.

Bottom Belgian gun is 28 bore but with 32ga inserts. Weight 4-14oz

My Francotte 28 gauge with 26" barrels is 4 pounds 11 oz

My 28 ga. Merkel built on a 28 ga. frame with 28" barrels is 5 lbs. 7 oz. and works for me. However at 5 lbs. 12 oz., my 12 ga. Churchill with 26' barrels choked .003" / .011" gets the nod frequently.
Karl

I guess I have shot heavy target guns too long. I just do not shoot very light guns well. I do well with a 20 or 28 that comes in around 6 pounds. Fit is 90% of shooting well for me, and the weight is the other 10%. Now carrying weight might favor lighter gun but shooting dynamic, for me and my shooting style, any small bore in the 6 pound range or 12 about 7 pounds works. But I’m not covering miles a day across rough ground or hunting jungle type cover. Light may work for you and I’m glad because every gun deserves its day in the field.

Thanks for all your experience and opinions.

I'm looking for a single trigger O/U 28ga that I can carry cold season for mountain grouse and gray partridge, and operate gloved. This morning there is fresh snow here and we still have 60 days of wild bird hunting remaining.

I already have the double trigger bases covered with a SXS at 5.5 lbs. I'm ready to reenter the world of O/U platforms, as I've hunted SXS almost exclusively for 20 yrs. plus I'd like a newer model suitable for all ammo.

One O/U 28ga I had my eye on is just under 7lbs., but obviously is on a 20ga frame. I'm going to keep looking for something sub-6lbs. with ~28 inch pipes. Any suggestions?

I believe that shooting reasonably light sub gauge guns develops a muscle memory that helps them work. At 75 years, heavy guns no longer work for me, target shooting/hunting or otherwise.
Karl

I have an A&F Zoli/Rizzini 28 bore scalloped boxlock that I purchased for my girls to shoot. It weighs 5lbs 1oz. and is too light for me to shoot or take hunting. I like all of my hunting guns right around 6 lbs and I can find more effective English 20's, 16's and 12's in that weight category, so I don't need one in 28ga. Just picked up a 16ga hammer double with 29" damascus barrels and a 15 3/8" stock weighing 6lbs even and can't wait to get in the grouse woods with it for a trial run!

If you are looking for a 6 pound OU think about the Ruger red label. Almost a cult gun these days. But 6-,6 1/4 pounds in 26&28”with choke tubes. But buy and shoot what you like, just not a ugly gun.

There's method to my madness. It's my only 28 and it serves as a sub-gauge gun at sporting clays shoots, with it's .410 and 28 ga. barrel sets. Then, in the quail and woodcock woods it's never for more than a half day at the time.

If I had to bust brush all day like some of you guys I'm sure I'd opt for a lighter gun. I know what it's like to struggle going from a 9 lb. duck gun to a sub-5 lb. .410. It's tough.

Didn't someone start a thread on here a few years ago showing how he went about modifying and lightening a 20 ga. Red Label?

My AYA #1 with 28 inch barrel comes in at 5.81 lbs, The Rizzini 702, o/u with 28 inch barrels comes in at 6.89 lbs. For fun, I put the CSMC Inverness, 28 inch barrels, 20 gauge came in at 6.51 lbs

I do not have a recommendation on maximum weight, but for snap shooting pointed grouse and woodcock in heavy cover, the lighter the better, IMO.

My Jeffery 28b weighs 4 pounds 5 ounces with 26” barrels, and I love it.

This 28 bore user, writing in the August 1936 issue of “The Gamekeeper” under “Pseudonym 28-bore” seemed happy with 4 1/2 pounds. That was probably a single hammer gun as he later refers having “climbed as high as a second -hand 20 bore hammerless”.



In those days (from same issue) .410 cartridges were cheaper than 12 bore from the same maker.

I cannot even imagine getting a gun that light to settle down when popping it to the shoulder. Maybe if you are 5' tall and weigh 110 lbs. Also, recoil must be pretty sharp at that near-toy weight. No thanks.
JR

No trouble at all shouldering my 4# gun. I'm 6'2" and about +/- 230#'s.

Oh, I'm sure you have zero problems shouldering it. Holding it steady, well...
JR

Its not a rifle I don't hold it steady. Most of what I shoot are flushed and fly hard in any direction. So steady is not something I don't have time for. I've shoot both triggers before the gun is completely shouldered a times.

Wow. Try one-handing it.
JR

Light guns are almost in their own world in terms of handling and use. I participated in a quail hunt with my little 28 about a year ago now that involved more birds than I've ever done before. The shooting was, as you'd expect, very different in that some (or even all) the birds would fly back over you from the flush. Because of the number of hunters, helpers, dogs, and then the birds, you really had to be extra-vigilant. In retrospect, a more-ideal gun there might well have been (gasp!) an unplugged small-gauge semi-auto (it seemed like birds were always flying by when I was reloading). By having a very light gun I never had a problem keeping up with the dogs or catching up to a flushing quail, but there were times when you had to be completely surgical about when you could safely shoot. Unlike more-conventional upland shooting, you had to both start and stop your gun and be hyper-aware of your surroundings. I know heavier guns are preferred in lots of situations and I have a 10-lb sporting clays gun that serves very well for the job it was designed to do, but... for the type of upland hunting I focus on so desperately (ruffed grouse in deciduous forests) a light and well-balanced gun is a both delight and even-more now a necessity as I'm becoming a "more-seasoned" citizen.

Anyone can learn to shoot a light gun. But you have to do it. Most people here and elswhere, shoot heavy guns at the range for trap and so forth, but then don't shoot well with a lighter, "whippy" gun. How many times has that been said here and on every other shotgunning forum? If you shoot light guns, they shoot every bit as well as heavy guns.

I spent the summer shooting a couple rounds of trap almost every week with a 26", 6# gun, from low-gun position. I can hit better with that gun now than any other I own. That's no surprise, it's just learning to shoot it. Moving back to a 7.25# gun is problematic. No surprise there either. I don't shoot long, ponderous guns well - because I haven't been shooting them. Maybe next year, I'll shoot a couple rounds of each and get used to going back and forth. Sort of like learning to shoot both Single triggers and double triggers.

Today, however, I made a really nice, longish, but super quick shot on a slicing grouse. Never would have happened with a 30", 7+# gun. I also covered 14 hot miles of rough ruffed grouse ground for the 3rd day in a row. 6# beats 7# every single time. It will tomorrow also.

Battle, I tried one of those off the shoulder shots today. Never had a chance....

Well, fwiw, there are light guns and ridiculously light guns. A 6 lb gun is one thing, but a 4.25 lb gun is more like a novelty than a tool, afaic. I cannot imagine ever learning to hit anything flying with it. ‘Course, if you’re getting off two shots before shouldering it…
JR

Suit yourself. What you cannot imagine, plenty of others have accomplished.

I have shoulder surgery scheduled for the end of the month
A light gun has keeps me in the game til then. If I had a sub5# 20 or 28, I'd use it. Maybe next year I will have it and can put off surgery on the 2nd shoulder one more year.

Better shoot pull away or pass through with those light guns. Maintained lead is much harder to maintain with a very light gun.

Agreed that very lightweight shotguns require, for me, a different style of shooting. I struggled with the little sub-5 lb. .410s until I discovered that I had to begin my "tracking" before the gun hit the shoulder. Then, fire almost immediately upon acquiring a cheek weld. Entirely different from shooting a heavier gun, for me. But, I never, ever felt the need to pull the trigger before the gun hit my shoulder pocket. To do that would be as near a guaranteed miss as anything I can think of.

Too light and they feel like a Daisy plus kick the snot out of you rendering a second shot moot!

You guys don't get out in the field much.

Pardon me while I laugh at "sustained lead". On a grouse....

Obviously (or not) that's not the norm. But has happened, especially getting off one trigger.

I'm not talking prairie hunting where you don't a have wall of honeysuckle or a cedar thicket to navigate just to flush a single quail that your dog has been on point for a dogs lifetime it seems for them. Or the flush of a grouse in a thicket of saplings no bigger than two fingers just to point at the hole you think you might intercept the bird with shot. No time for "sustained lead". If you've hunting ruffed grouse where I've hunted and tried "swing and follow" you'd walk out of the woods with dented barrels.

Shoot what you like.

“Fast to start, fast to stop.”

“Poke and hope.”

The numbers on ruffed grouse off the flush don’t lie.

A fast handling gun yields greater first shot kill percentages.
Snaking your way through a thicket, one handing your shotgun, is normal and common.

Again, hunting individually, or in pairs, over pointing dogs.

Now that leaf drop is over, the birds are hunkered under stuff, and the woods seem more open.
You can use a longer, heavier gun, and more target style techniques than earlier.

Run what you like.
Getting tangled up is part of the fun.

I always lament the annual retirement of my hunting shorts.

I presume you have already rejected the Benelli 3” 28ga semi auto?
Perfect for your late season, non tox, open country, shooting.

If focusing purely on O/U, look for a 28ga w/ alloy receiver, and 28” monoblock barrels.

Yildiz comes to mind.

Dickinson will be another option.

Presuming you want new, under $5k, for your test, with modern ammunition necessity.

As for the earlier question, why carry a 28 that is as fat as a 20?

Look at the Rizzini BR110 in 28 gauge. 6.1 pounds in all-steel, 5.7 pounds in alloy frame. Around $2K. The steel BR110 is available in multiple barrel lengths up to 32" on special order (I"m sure that would take a small eternity), the Light Luxe version (alloy) only in 28".

Bruce

More like attempted.
JR

Evidently you assume the only wild bird hunting in thick stuff is in the grouse woods, and that we hunt woodcock down here in cow pastures or soybean fields.

But, I guess that's understandable coming from a professor who is so egotistical to believe he saw the very first coyote to set foot on all 310 square miles (198,000 acres) of SRS, when we had been trapping them for several years just two miles away.

Go ahead and laugh if you want Brent. I am a grouse hunter and I can assure you there are scenarios in the grouse coverts where an opportunity for sustained lead presents itself (e.g., an old apple orchard or an abandoned farm field) just like there are occasional opportunities where a 3rd shot is possible (where’s my AutoMaybe), although rare.

I have "classic" 28-gauges doubles that weigh in the five to five and three quarter pound range, but I shoot a couple of modern 28-gauges in the six and a quarter pound range much better and there is the problem. I have 20-gauges that weigh in the six and a quarter pound range from my 1913 vintage Fox A-grade to my Launch Edition RBL and the 20-gauge can handle a wider variety of loads. So, what is the point of the 28-gauge?

For hunting I prefer 6 pound guns in the uplands, even in the 12. Much below that I just don't shoot them well. More than 6 1/4 pounds is a bit more than I want to carry at the end of the day.

For clays I have dropped down to 7 pounds to 7.5 pounds as my sweet spot. If I go above that it messes me up for my hunting guns. And as I get older it seems to take more "work" to get those big pigs moving for the second shot in tight windows.

I shot a grouse this year with sustained lead through tall pines as it was quartering away from me, typical gray ghost steak but I had good glimpses of it. I did miss it however.

Many of my shots at grouse are typical shoot the streak and swing through but not all of them. I hunt a flusher and even though the dog on the ground the most this year just turned 2 I could usually tell when he was birdy and was prepared. Have been hunting ruff for more than 50 years now.



6 pound 16 ga. Iside is my go to grouse gun. And all around gun for hunting although have more than a few others in the 6 pound range.


My first thought as well. I have two B. Rizzini 12 ga. Vertex, 32" Competition 16 and 20 ga. 32" BR110 Sporter. Obviously my B. Rizzini guns are all clay guns but I wouldn't hesitate to pick up a field Rizzini. Of any type. ~June of next year I will likely do a custom order for a BR552 16\20 combo for hunting they come in at ~6 pounds. In the meantime I use Battista's brother Isidero Rizzini (the I & R in F.A.I.R.) guns for hunting. I am waiting to hear back from the director of Italian Firearms Group in Texas for the total on a custom order 16 ga. Iside with the specs I have given him.


Pretty much the same place I am at, although for the 16 ga. I don't even own a 20 ga. hunting gun. Wait I do have a 20 ga. Ithaca 37 UL in the safe. But haven't shot it in years it is just too light and I don't shoot it well. Many of my friends shoot 28 ga. and have been trying to talk me into one. Just can't bring myself to do it from a logical standpoint. I do have several 20 ga. SxS guns for clays. Because if you are going to give me a 3 or 4 bird handicap for shooting yellow shells I'll take it. Shooting feathers I don't want a handicap, of any kind.

Yesterday, I came upon a 20-30 acre patch of doghair popple that was bordered with spruce and fir. Looked pretty perfect for grouse, so Gus and I serpentined our way in. It was almost entirely one handing the gun (6# cashmore) and pushing aside saplings with the other. I was thinking of this thread the whole time and how fun it would be to watch Stan with his 32" barrels fighting through this...

Anyway, we came out the other side with two grouse on two flushes and three shots. Had to use the poke and shoot twice on the first bird. Anyone that thinks he is going to "sustained lead" in a popple thicket, ain't been in a popple thicket.

But that big gun would sure be good for beating off those scary coyotes (and wolves!), so there is that.

My phone tells me I covered 39.1 miles of grouse country in the 3.5 days of hunting. I'm happy to have carried the 6# Cashmore while leaving the 7.25# Greener behind. A 5.5# sidelock 16 or 20 might be even nicer - if I can find one I like as much as that Cashmore.

Brent,

Is that the one with SLEEVED emblazoned on both side of the barrels?

Yup. It's becoming a real favorite. Whomever sleeved it did an excellent job. Perfectly regulated as well.

They did well to keep the weight down to 6 pounds.

They certainly did it well. I've seen a fairly large number of resleeved and reproofed English guns appearing on the market lately. Most of them appear to be excellent. But there is someone that is resleaving unlabeled vintage actions with barrels "spuriously labeled" and Holland and Holland (one on RIA and 2 or 3 on Holts).

Interesting .......that you fantasize that way. However, nowhere have I ever said I'd try to use 32" barrels in heavy upland cover.

Deleted

I have one of the higher grade 28 gauge FAIR SxS’s w/30” barrels and a 15” stock. It weighs 5 lbs. 7.5 oz and it’s a surprisingly easy shooter. It’s not remotely whippy and if anything it’s on the slower end of the continuum.

Here’s a mid 30’s NID that grew up “down south”.
Quail don’t you think?
5 lbs 13 ounces

What gauge, Bob?

Um, uh, 28 gauge as the thread suggests.
1 of only 42 grade 1’s in 28 gauge.

The thread wandered a bit. Doesn't sound like I'll be running across one of those soon.

another NID 28ga for your viewing pleasure.

https://www.gunsinternational.com/g...intage-firearms-inc.cfm?gun_id=102047488