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Has anyone used either Vintage Firearms or Bachelors (boty in Grand Rapids MI) for classic shotgun mechanical work? I had Bachelors re brown a set of Damascus tubes years ago, but now need a single trigger looked at. And possibly chokes opened up a bit. Either of these shops is within driving distance which is why I'm considering them, I don't particularly wish to trust this double to the Post.... I like it too much smile
Bachelder had a good reputation, but he died.

I do not know if the metal work done there now measures up.

It’s getting harder to get things repaired, because the men that worked on them as a normal thing are all about gone now.

So, fewer craftsmen, longer waits .
Originally Posted by ClapperZapper
It’s getting harder to get things repaired, because the men that worked on them as a normal thing are all about gone now.

So, fewer craftsmen, longer waits .

Sad, but true.
Brad and I were good friends and bird hunting companions, with his 2 fine Yellow Labs, for many years. I cannot speak for the quality of the work now being done at his shop since his passing though. I have not yet either bought a used doublegun,snor had any gunsmithing work done by Vintage also in Grand Rapids- Let me just say this--every time I have been in Brad's shop on Plymouth Ave- they have always been busy with customers picking up their guns--Parkers, Smiths, pre- 1964 Winchesters, Colts, Sigs, etc.-- Brad's oldest son Carson is the shop specialist for all the Police and LEF groups on their weapons-for all of Kent Co. and sometimes on out-of-area weapons their (MSP) armorers are not capable of handling. And Brad's widow, Lori- who handles all the paperwork, shipping, ordering, is a first class Lady-- Of course, I am partial to old friends, and I have never done business including gunsmithing work, with Vintage-- RWTF
Brad and I were good friends and bird hunting companions, with his 2 fine Yellow Labs, for many years. I cannot speak for the quality of the work now being done at his shop since his passing though. I have not yet either bought a used doublegun,snor had any gunsmithing work done by Vintage also in Grand Rapids- Let me just say this--every time I have been in Brad's shop on Plymouth Ave- they have always been busy with customers picking up their guns--Parkers, Smiths, pre- 1964 Winchesters, Colts, Sigs, etc.-- Brad's oldest son Carson is the shop specialist for all the Police and LEF groups on their weapons-for all of Kent Co. and sometimes on out-of-area weapons their (MSP) armorers are not capable of handling. And Brad's widow, Lori- who handles all the paperwork, shipping, ordering, is a first class Lady-- Of course, I am partial to old friends, RWTF
Fox, you get good at what you do a lot of.
As soon as you start mentioning police work on polymer pistols, the likelihood that I’m going to get a new bridle carefully made goes way down.

People have to make a living, and the living is in doing trigger jobs on Glock’s.
You might ask Chris Dawe (a quality gunsmith from Newfoundland) about Bachelder. I know he went and worked with Brad a time or two and, just before Brad died, had a multi month working visit lined up. Chris might have some insight about those who are now doing the work. He's a member here under his own name

Vintage is seriously into the vintage game and I'd be surprised if his repair dept was crap. But I've been surprised before.
I had VFI repair a missing piece of wood on a classic sxs and the repair was perfect. I knew where to look and still couldn't see the repair line. Not cheap
I've been very satisfied with Del Whitman's work, located in Traverse City. He started his career working for Rigby I believe. Others I know who have used him have been happy as well.
Karl
Originally Posted by Karl Graebner
I've been very satisfied with Del Whitman's work, located in Traverse City. He started his career working for Rigby I believe. Others I know who have used him have been happy as well.
Karl

Karl, doesn't Del focus on wood work? I've heard much good about his stocking, and seen his work. But I'm primarily needing a single selective trigger made reliable
Glocks or other "plastic pistols" do NOT figure in my scope of gun-smithing work. In the past, Brad has: (1) built a older GH 12 No. 2 frame receiver that had been converted from an extractor gun to an ejector by a Minn. Gunsmith ageas ago- fitted it to a pg buttstock with Pachmayr red pad, and a set of 28" Vulcan steel ejector barrels and forearm. This was written up and pictured in Parker Pages about 10-11 years ago- I still have this "orphaned Parker GHE 12-and use it for preserve pheasants, along with a 1940 M21 12 gauge 28" barrels, SST, EJ field grade gun I inherited from my late Father- I could, I should guess, shoot them as a composed pair should I ever end up on a Grouse Moor as a guest of The Duke of Earl-- Brad also fitted a set of 30" 12 gauge ejector barrels to a 12 gauge Smith Grade 4e- which I still own. He also converted a 1929 Ideal 12 LONGRANGE from a SST to a double trigger set-up--all wor k was, and still is, flawless.

Insofar as handguns are concerned, I own a shoot 4 older Colts- a Python .357 and a Police Positive .38 "snubbie" and 2 pre-WW11 Woodsmen .22's- all are "Steinways" and have never failed to function- I have zerointerest in modern "plastic pistols' nor ever will, so you point about being a master gunsmith who specializes in handguns-- the late Armand Swenson and Bob Chow from CA come to mind--I cannot speak to that point, well taken as it may be-- RWTF
RWTF, I think CZ's point was in regard to Brad's son Carson, not Brad. Doesn't really matter now how good Brad was. He won't be doing the work.
Bachelder employs a number of tradesman some specializing in vintage guns and some modern. It’s not like it’s just Carson and Lori.

I’ve had work done at Bachelder’s before and after Brad passed and I have not been disappointed.
Originally Posted by claycrusher1900
Originally Posted by Karl Graebner
I've been very satisfied with Del Whitman's work, located in Traverse City. He started his career working for Rigby I believe. Others I know who have used him have been happy as well.
Karl

Karl, doesn't Del focus on wood work? I've heard much good about his stocking, and seen his work. But I'm primarily needing a single selective trigger made reliable

Del’s metal work is flawless, his engraving is spectacular and he has experience making parts for guns from Purdey, Boss, Holland, etc.
Claycrusher,
Del repaired a single trigger on a Holland for Eis, and it was very well done. He did some work on my Churchill and I was very pleased. I consider him a classically trained fine gunsmith and wouldn't hesitate to recommend him.
Karl
Ooops- omitted Jeff and Brad's younger son, Parker--I believe, but am not 100% sure that Vintage Firearms head gunsmith is Kevin Duchene, former gunsmith with the now "gone with the wind" Gander Mountain operation in Grand Rapids. FWIWIP-- back in the day when Cabela's (pre-Bass-Ackwards-Blow Shop era) and Ganer Mt. were competitors in the pre-owned high end firearms market- Gander had one advantage in that market- ALL of their used firearms came with a one year warranty- and they all were checked over and test fired before put out on the racks for sale. Cabela's did NOT do this--apparently didn't think it was important-- oh well--- RWTF
So it sounds like all three places are capable and have done excellent work for people on here.... wow, it's nice to see options and several local craftsmen! I'll probably call them next week and see if it's a job they are willing/want to take on. I've read on here that SST's can be a challenge
Phillip's gunsmithing in East Texas is the best general gunsmith and Very Best trigger man I have run into in 50 years of looking!
Call 210 313 5988. He builds a release trigger of great merit but more important he understands triggers.

bill
As a follow up, 9.5 months later I got my Cashmore back, untouched. I had gotten quite a few different answers over the phone calls during that time, talked to Parker today and he never did anything with it. He said he is stepping back from gunsmithing, so plan to use a different gunsmith if you need work done!

And now back to square one frown
Claycrusher,
Del Whitman did some work on a trouble prone single trigger for Eis on a Holland or Boss, and it was perfect. I know that Eis had Brad's son do some work on a Parker that seemed to take forever, and he won't go back. Del has never failed either of us.
Karl
Thanks! I'll look into Del. I have a recommendation from a friend for a guy who is the gunsmith at Krieghoff too, hopefully one of them will have time! I might shoot it for a couple weeks as a single barrel before parting with it for another long spell. Not sure who to trust either- Bachelders had done a fantastic Damascus refinish for me in the last, but their false stories sure soured me on smiths. But interestingly, he confirmed the rumor that they had done the Damascus refinishing for Turnbull as many suspected. Had being rhe operative word
I really like my Dad's old Ithaca 37 16 ga. I take it out sometimes and look at it. (for the uneducated and new here, this is a facetious example of RWTF's anecdotal thread hijacking posts.)
JR
+1 for Del Whitman. He did a great job putting a pre-Great War German SxS back on face.
Originally Posted by Run With The Fox
Ooops- omitted Jeff and Brad's younger son, Parker--I believe, but am not 100% sure that Vintage Firearms head gunsmith is Kevin Duchene, former gunsmith with the now "gone with the wind" Gander Mountain operation in Grand Rapids. FWIWIP-- back in the day when Cabela's (pre-Bass-Ackwards-Blow Shop era) and Ganer Mt. were competitors in the pre-owned high end firearms market- Gander had one advantage in that market- ALL of their used firearms came with a one year warranty- and they all were checked over and test fired before put out on the racks for sale. Cabela's did NOT do this--apparently didn't think it was important-- oh well--- RWTF

Back in the day, Cabelas had a no questions asked return policy on used firearms. Obviously gone now with the Bass Pro merger, and I believe they may have changed it at some point prior to the merger.
I have had very BAD experience with Vintage Firearms of Grand Rapids (Jay Shachter).

I sent a cased double shotgun to be on consignment for sale with them. There were no cracks in the forend wood when they received it. There was no correspondence by them or mention to me about any cracks or wood issues at any time.

They had my gun for over two years without selling it. I agreed to lower the price a couple times to generate interest.

When I requested return of the gun, I received an invoice for wood repairs along with being billed for expenses for them taking photos and listing on his website (which was never discussed previously) totaling just under $1000!

I paid the bill under protest with Jay just to get my gun returned.

When I received the gun, it's hard case was not included, only the gun alone. I called about it. They said they couldn't find it.

Beware if you consider doing any business with them.
Originally Posted by dukxdog
I have had very BAD experience with Vintage Firearms of Grand Rapids (Jay Shachter).

I sent a cased double shotgun to be on consignment for sale with them. There were no cracks in the forend wood when they received it. There was no correspondence by them or mention to me about any cracks or wood issues at any time.

They had my gun for over two years without selling it. I agreed to lower the price a couple times to generate interest.

When I requested return of the gun, I received an invoice for wood repairs along with being billed for expenses for them taking photos and listing on his website (which was never discussed previously) totaling just under $1000!

I paid the bill under protest with Jay just to get my gun returned.

When I received the gun, it's hard case was not included, only the gun alone. I called about it. They said they couldn't find it.

Beware if you consider doing any business with them.

Wow.
JR
yah see, this is why threads like this are so inappropriate...

we go along nicely for ah while until some malcontent cant stand hit no mo an jes has to throw a bomb...

the story makes vintage firearms sound like a bunch of incompetent, irresponsible fools...which they are not...

what a terrible misuse of this fine forum...

the old adage still applies...if you aint got nuttin nice to say bout someone, den jes dont say nuttin...
Originally Posted by ed good
yah see, this is why threads like this are so inappropriate...

we go aong nicely for ah while until some malcontent cant stand hit no mo an jes has to throw a bomb...

the story makes vintage firearms sound like a buch of incompetent, irresponsible fools...which they are not...

what a terrible misuse of this fine forum...

Your post makes dukxdog (Bobby) seem like a malcontent-which, he is not.

Not every dealer is s a Saint, ed.

Best,
Ted
ted, neva said every dealer was a saint...

nor is this the appropriate place to air ones grievances...

bad mouthin someone here is such a cheap shot...
Originally Posted by ed good
ted, neva said every dealer was a saint...

nor is this the appropriate place to air ones grievances...

bad mouthin someone here is such a cheap shot...

This is a double gun forum, ed. It is a site for the sharing of information related to double guns. It is not a glossy catalog of your, or anyone else’s wares that are to not be questioned.

Bobby has a lot of friends that speak very highly of him. I’m not on that long list, but, I could be, I suppose. Still, I don’t doubt a word he has posted. It is only a cheap shot if it isn’t true, ed. I know dealers that operate exactly as Bobby described.

Best,
Ted
Originally Posted by Ted Schefelbein
Originally Posted by ed good
yah see, this is why threads like this are so inappropriate...

we go aong nicely for ah while until some malcontent cant stand hit no mo an jes has to throw a bomb...

the story makes vintage firearms sound like a buch of incompetent, irresponsible fools...which they are not...

what a terrible misuse of this fine forum...

Your post makes dukxdog (Bobby) seem like a malcontent-which, he is not.

Not every dealer is s a Saint, ed.

Best,
Ted

Thanks Ted.
Latest rumor on Bachelder's is that Carson, Brad's eldest son from his first marriage, has left the company for other opportunities, and that Parker is holding off on taking in any new gunsmithing work, at least for now. Best thing might be to give them a call and ask Parker exactly what is the situation. As I do not have any guns in need of such work, I am "out of the loop" at present. RWTF
Originally Posted by ed good
ted, neva said every dealer was a saint...

nor is this the appropriate place to air ones grievances...

bad mouthin someone here is such a cheap shot...

Why is this not an appropriate place to air legitimate grievances about gunsmiths and gun dealers, Ed? I can hardly think of a better place.....one filled with knowledgeable gun people.

This is an axe you like to grind, Ed and you are just wrong. Your position as a gun dealer clouds and compromises your opinion.

If Bobby said he had that experience, we should believe him and act accordingly. Just as we do when at other times, when dealers and smiths are highly praised.....including Jay and Vintage Firearms.

As an aside, I've had many conversations with Bobby and in fact was trading emails with him this morning. He is a stand up guy, as anyone who has attended his hunt camp will attest.
Posted By: SKB Re: Vintage firearms Grand Rapids vs Bachelders - 02/25/23 11:52 PM
I find you generally will receive positive reviews from those you do business with if you offer them a return period after inspection, offer honest descriptions and and do not add in hidden costs. At least that has been my experience selling guns for the last 20 years, YMMV.
so booby must be some special character who has the right to burden us with his problems with somebody else?

problem is, in this case, that somebody else is not present here to defend himself...and even if he were, he should not have too do so here...

this aint the place to air ones issues wid udders...only mean spirited individuals would do so...
Originally Posted by ed good
so booby must be some special character who has the right to burden us with his problems with somebody else?

problem is, in this case, that somebody else is not present here to defend himself...and even if he were, he should not have too do so here...

this aint the place to air ones issues wid udders...only mean spirited individuals would do so...

What a bunch of horseshit Ed.

Just curious…..where do you think an appropriate place would be for such airings.
well, a man to man phone call with the other party might be appropriate...

grown men of good will should be able to work out their business problems...
Originally Posted by ed good
well, a man to man phone call with the other party might be appropriate...

grown men of good will should be able to work out their business problems...

Ed, did you read the details? “Paid under protest”. That suggests a conversation. Bobby received his gun back. No case. They told him they couldn’t find it. That suggests another conversation.

You write “grown men of good will”. That’s Bobby’s point…….in his experience he wasn’t dealing with a grown man of good will.
Say what, John.. You like to accuse me of "high-jacking" your posts. I do Not deal in Ithaca M37's, regardless of gauge, so from whence does your accusation come, pray tell. Kindly refresh my memory on this, and after careful reviewing, should I feel like tendering you an apology, I shall do so forthwith. I have a few friends on this sit from Deep Dixie, but sadly, you are, at present, not in that number. More than e-mail friends, they are also gentlemen with great gun knowledge, and to whom I have sold gun related items over the past years. Somehow, I cannot seem to find a way to include you in that smallish number. Can we correct that sad situation perhaps?? RWTF
I have had mixed results with Vintage. They did sell a couple guns for me, but similar to the other comment, claimed they had to fix things before selling. In at least one case I know that particular claim was untrue.
I stopped by a few times at the Vintage Firearms tables at a couple of the Spring Southern SxS in Sanford, NC several years ago. I got the sense one could easily get sh*tted by them. His descriptions on his gun ads are way too ostentatious for me as well.
JR
now this is gittin interestin...we got three complaints now...duxdog, nitro an mr roberts...

i see an opportunity for inter tain ment here, via sum creative plot development...

ware ders smoke, der could be fare...or mist...or sum thin...

anyway, its sunday morning an snowin...

last year, day closed the last church in my pitcher resque little new england town...

an hits too far an too cold to take a ride to the nearest bar...

so, lets bah gin...

three unsolisi ted complaints are grounds to create a tribunel...

consisting of a panel of judges, lets make it nine members...volunteers are hereby solisitated...i nominate foxie...

a procequter...obviously canvas back...

a defender, yours truly, if no one else wants the job...

problem is, we aint got no defendent...as ray aint no known member of this here fine forum...

sooo...if no one objects, i will play the role of ray, the acused, evil, money driven, untrust worthy an suspicious double gon dealer...

an if no one objects, i will also take the role of court reporter...

so, let us bah gin...

we need to empanel a panel o judges...volunteers, pls step forward...
Put a sock in it, ed.


Best,
Ted
aw gee ted, you aint no fun...

ah had you pegged fur ah judgeship fur sur...

come on boys...dont be shy...step right up here...

hey foxie...watt bout you?
Put a sock in it, ed.

Best,
Ted
JUdge not, lest ye be judged.. Words of wisdom apply here, Eddie. RWTF
foxie, ah aint judgin no body...

fact is, three acuse sations have been made here...agin ray...

as ray aint here, ah am but seekin duh trut..

in rays defence...

shirley you would particapate in the name of fairness...

today hits ray...tomorrow hit could be you...or ted or even yours truly...

ah mean, even dem ru shans could be coludin wid you no who to git awl our gons...

ah need ah drink...im gonna chance hit an take a ride in the snow...
OK, Edster- if a quote from the good book doesn't indicate to you my non-interest in acting as a judge for your "event"-- I'll share some wisdom my grandfather gave me, years ago: "Avoid getting in any pissin' contests- only a skunk can win anyway!!"" RWTF "And don't call me Shirley!""add
well, guess we aint gonna have no trial...
Your defendant is Jay not ray.

Where there's smoke...

I actually felt bad for you once.
no trial, no smile...
Posted By: mc Re: Vintage firearms Grand Rapids vs Bachelders - 03/01/23 03:12 PM
Edd, try not being a moron
John, if you can kindly give the coordinates for the supposed thread of yours that I "Hijacked" regarding your 16 gauge Ithaca M37, I would be most happy to have it deleted. Fair enough?? RWTF
Originally Posted by Run With The Fox
John, if you can kindly give the coordinates for the supposed thread of yours that I "Hijacked" regarding your 16 gauge Ithaca M37, I would be most happy to have it deleted. Fair enough?? RWTF
It was a fictitious example of how you oftentimes go off on some unrelated tangent from the subject at hand. I'm not going to go hunt for the "coordinates". And it's not intended with malice, just hoping to get you away from doing it. We're all somewhat guilty of it, it just seems you're a chronic repeat offender. I don't think it matters in the greater scheme of things...
JR
I vote for Vintage Firearms I bought multiple American shotguns from them. They told me about the work they did, and what was wrong with them and i still can't see it... I wish they didn't tell me.
Originally Posted by aw1776
I vote for Vintage Firearms I bought multiple American shotguns from them. They told me about the work they did, and what was wrong with them and i still can't see it... I wish they didn't tell me.

Maybe they didn't really do anything? Could it be? smile
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