I saw a damascus barreled gun that has most of the constriction removed. Is this possible to get choke tubes installed? Just wondering. Thanks!

I’ve got my doubts.

Does anybody remember the time a guy asked if he could have his 2” English 12
gauge chambers let out to 2 3/4”?

Not the same, but fun to ponder.

Best,
Ted

Hehe. That was funny, Ted.

Why is this a silly question? In the UK the proof test has become very strict and therefor many older guns are rejected from proof due to being originally proofed for 2 1/2 inch cartridges only to find the chambers measure some random size somewhere between 2 and 2 1/2 inch. In my experience its quite common to find short or long chambered older guns, to pass a new proof one must have the chambers dropped to within the new tolerances for the new size ranges.

To the question can you have choke tubes put in - yes if there is enough wall thickness for the purpose, some old hammer guns i have seen would lack the required thickness at the muzzle.

Its not a silly question, but why would someone do that to an old Damascus gun??? You got me....

I don't believe Briley will install tubes in pattern welded barrels, but sent an email asking.

I vaguely recall back in 2008 when Vic Venters reported on Greener's manufacture of new doubles with vintage damascus tubes, a comment possibly by David Dryhurst that there was some challenge cutting the chokes? that the barrel would not cut smoothly but would chip/fragment? Does anyone else remember?

There are some that solder in choke tubes but to put in a threaded choke tube is not recommended

Mike Orlen does solder in chokes. I have a 12ga single shot hammer gun with cylinder choke I've considered doing that way. We're talking about choke, not chambering so what's the harm?..Geo

I do not remember that Doc Drew. I have opened up a whole pile of tight chokes on damascus tubes and they cut just in my experience.
Steve

Thanks Steve.
I'll post if I hear back from Briley.

I remember an old thread with a similar comment dealing with the installation of threaded choke tubes in damascus barrels, but on the other hand Toby Barclay may do just that.

I don't know if Briley still provides this service for pattern welded barrels, but they certainly did back in the early 2000's when installing their chokes in an E.C. Green damascus gun owned by a shooting friend of mine.

The reason for doing so was to correct poorly regulated barrels (cause unknown) that were off by many inches even at 25 yards. My friend bought it as a 'shooter' for the various vintage events that were becoming popular back then and was pretty disappointed to find it virtually unshootable. Briley requested that he provide a goodly number of pattern sheets, from which they eccentrically reamed and threaded both barrels to shoot as they should. I can only say that I witnessed both the before and after results and the gun shot to center thereafter - and saw a lot of use on sporting clays.

What they are doing today, I have no idea.

Briley responded that they DO install choke tubes in Damascus barrels, but did not reply as to whether these are screw-in choke tubes or permanent sleeved tubes.

That’s a typical Briley response these days. Long on their capabilities, short on the details. No way they can install permanent sleeves or choke tubes if the muzzles don’t meet a thickness standard. Most Damascus barreled hammerguns have razor thin muzzles...if that’s the case, no way they can do either, unless they cut the barrels to a point that has the right amount of material for the machining.

With that said....I ordered a couple of Briley chokes to fit a older beretta recently....they were horribly undersized (length). I cancelled my order with them after two months of back and forth....anyway, I won’t buy Briley stuff anymore or have them do barrel work for me either. They definitely aren’t what they used to be.

As said above, it all depends on the thickness of the barrel wall, at the muzzle. Teague will do steel or damascus but only if there is plenty of wall thickness. I don't think they differentiate between fixed or thin-wall interchangeables.
They recently refused a set of Whitworth steel barrels on their wall thickness that I sentr them.
Another issue raised by Demonwolf444 is the matter of reproof. Teague will not do any insert choke work without submitting for reproof (as is correct by proof rules) and then you enter a whole world of jointing, bore, chamber, rim recess spec which could make the job much more challenging!

Screw in chokes are one thing. Soldered in permanent chokes are another...Geo

Cutting threads in Damascus barrels and opening chokes in Damascus barrels I would think are two different processes involving two different sets of problems/obstacles, wouldn't you agree? I would expect chipping to occur when cutting threads in Damascus.

It is a silly question, here, in the US. Off the shelf loads in this country are often loaded right up to SAAMI spec, which, means you would be firing a load at or above proof level in your English 2” chamber gun, that someone let out to 2 3/4”, every, single, time you pulled the trigger. We have no proof house, and, perhaps more importantly, very few gunsmiths talented enough to perform a view before and after a proof session. I can think of one. He apprenticed at Holland’s.

It has only been in recent years that lower pressure loads have been widely available in the US. You don’t need a load that will reliably cycle a dirty gas autoloading gun in your 100 year old double, but, at most retailers, that is the ammunition you will get.

To the choke tube matter, most gunsmiths, here, aren’t interested in the liability of modifications to Damascus barrels. Your gunsmith in England is going to cut the barrels for tubes, taking it out of proof, and then, by law, submit it for reproof, where it will pass or fail. If the gun fails, here, after that work, the gunsmith will most likely hear from a lawyer.

The gunsmith here, has no control as to what loads go into the gun. Usually, neither does the owner, unless he is astute.

English 2” chamber guns typically run light in weight. I can’t imagine why anyone would want to fire a 2 3/4” SAAMI spec load in one, or, want to lengthen a 2” guns chamber in order to be able to do so.

This isn’t England. It would be silly to do either, here.

Best,
Ted

I would agree but I did not think Drew was referring to threading for tubes in his post when he mentioned cutting chokes. I certainly could be mistaken though, it would not be the first time.

There are the soldered permanent tubes, and there are also permanent tubes installed with black LocTite. That LocTite has a specific designation, but I don't remember the details. Somewhere I have an article from years ago about that process, and I think the installation was in pattern welded barrels. I may be able to find it next week when I get back to that computer.

OP appears to be in the US, so British proof requirements are pretty much irrelevant, except from a cautionary perspective consistent with shooting all old guns.

As to why one would want to do this, my reason would be to put some usable choke in a Cyl/Cyl gun. Those chokes would make the gun useless to me.

Briley can do either screw-in or permanent:
5 choke package installed is $499 (12 or 20ga)
Permanent install is $460.

Strictly from a machinist's viewpoint, I would anticipate no problem in threading for screw-in chokes. No more so than opening chokes with a reamer. As already well pointed out it is necessary there be ample wall thickness for the job. Those thine wall at the muzzles apply equally to a lot of hammerless Damascus barrels, same as the Hammer guns.