I recently purchased the August and September 2014 edition of the British magazine,"Classic Arms & Militaria" at Barnes and Noble.Pages 52-5 features an article by Bill Harriman, a British historian. The article incudes an an interesting review of the development and demise of the Birmingham gun Quarter from the 17th,century to the present day. Of special interest to collectors is a across reference linking gun makers to their respective factory names.
hello roy,
sounds like a worthwhile and interesting article.i shall try and obtain a copy.
best wishes
mrwmartin
Roy, that cross reference really sounds interesting. Did you see any surprises ?
The article can be viewed here. Page 51 and forward.
http://issuu.com/jojoii/docs/classic_arms___militaria_2014-08-09
One of my major regrets is in the early 60s I worked in Birmingham and being interested in guns and their manufacture I visited what was left of Birmingham’s gun quarter on a number of occasions. I remember walking down Price street and Lower Loveday street where there were still two story buildings containing workshops and outside the entrance doors to the buildings where name plates one on top of the other each plate proclaiming who and what was their trade and the regret I never took any photographs of the name plates or the streets.
damascus,
I attend college and university in Birmingham during the 1950's and early 1960's. Over the past 50 years I visited Birmingham most years,always making a point of visiting the the Gun quarter, Powell's and Westley Richards.
Fortunately I did take pictures of the Gun Quarter before and after the construction of the ring road that resulted in the destruction of majority of the buildings in gun quarter.
For years it has been my intention to publish same but I never seem to find time to complete my research.
Picture of the Birmingham gun quarter during its destruction can be found on the web site of the late Phyllis Nicklin, a researcher at Birmingham university.
http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/showthread.php/52519-Gun-Factory-Birmingham-May-2010Not shotguns as such but some pictures from inside the derelict Parker Hale factory taken by a member of a UK 'urban exploration' group.
I was surprised by the amount of parts left and guess they were destined to be the cut away No.4 Enfields that showed the workings judging thy the red paint on the cut stocks .
http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/show...Birmingham-2011Another link to the same site showing some bottles with familiar names on.
El Garro, those pictures are really something. thanks. Somewhat like the deserted Alaska gold mining towns a half century or more ago. Tools of the trades, bank statements, canned goods, ----all still in their last places of use. I wish I had pictures of that.
Thanks Daryl, there are some links at the bottom of the page to other pages showing the gun works. While I'm not an urban explorer myself I've had a good look on the site. There are some stunning pics. There may be a link to North Wales hospital., it's close to where I live and it's a derelict asylum. That's how I stumbled onto 28 days later.
Sorry for going off the thread a little.
http://www.bsatrust.org/If you like the old factory pics this may be of interest aswell.
Apologies if I seem to have hijacked the thread.
The same people went into the oldest UK Lead shot drop tower at Chester that has been derelict for many years, some of the photographs are awesome of the inside especially when you think people worked in such dangerous conditions.
Thanks Damascus, I hadn't seen that one. Our neck of the woods too eh.
nice pictures...I f ind it amazing that some really awesome Guns
were created in such dingy crude looking places, a real testament
to the old school Gunmakers with their names chalked on their doors...god bless them
franc
I'm sure this link has been posted before but it probably warrants a re-visit in this thread:
http://www.birminghamgunmuseum.com/Home_Page.phpTim
Having worked in Price St for a couple of years in the late 70s I remember some of the old buildings .New Buildings 63 Price Street was new as far as any one could find out in 1862/3.
Not many photos as lets face it in those days photos were not cheap ,not every body had cameras and no one would want to waste film on photographing their work place .I am currently trying to get photos of the Webley factory at Park Lane for a project I am hoping to put together about the Park Lane years but from the point of view of those that worked there .
Gunman, any additional information you can scrounge up would be most appreciated. A fragment here and another there eventually might paint a pretty complete picture of what was a fascinating industry. Go for it!
http://birminghamhistory.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=37087&page=5I stumbled onto this site on the Web and thought the pictures may be of interest . Hope it's okay to resurrect the thread.
These historical information threads are fascinating. The Webley and Scott action thread's relevance to the gun trade in particular. The information on Wolverhampton being a major source of actions especially. Is it safe to say that Wolverhampton area was the major source of actions for both Birmingham as well as London?
It looks like this passage from the referenced link lends credence, as Wolverhampton was in the Black Country:
"A few branches of the gun trade, such as lock-making were undertaken in the Black Country. The location of barrel-making, which required some heavy machinery, was restricted by the need for water or steam power (only 9 of the 27 gun barrel makers in Pigot’s 1829 Directory had locations within the Gun Quarter.) Most branches, however, could be carried on in any small factory or workshop and their congregation in one particular part of Birmingham was a natural result of the need for close contact between material maker, manufacturer and setter-up. If materials had to be collected from or sent out to places beyond the Gun Quarter, additional costs would arise from the consequent expenditure of time and effort.”
I've essentially answered my own question regarding lock making with this passage:
"The reason for this concentration in such a small area is to be found in the organisation of the Gun Trade. At an early stage the need to speed up production led to division of labour and the trade soon separated into a number of branches, each specialising in one process. Perhaps the first activity to become clearly defined as a separate branch of the trade was the making of gun locks, which became concentrated in Wolverhampton and Willenhall during the 18th century. Barrel welding probably developed as a separate trade during the same period."
So, we have "Gun Makers" who orchestrated the process utilizing "Material Makers" and "Setters-Ups"..
Does anyone know the sources of the forgings? Did England have the equivalent of the Schilling forge that serviced the Suhl trade?
Regards
Ken
I believe there were a few main firms producing forgings for the trade. I'd presume they supplied to numerous action makers. Some, no doubt would have supplied barrelled actions or finished guns. There was a thread on here about it a while back.
I find it fascinating that so many individuals and small firms worked together , some for a main maker, others having parts on their benches for several makers at any one time. It was proper free lance stuff, the best would have work everyday of the year while others moved around and took work where they could. Imagine trying to organise a business like that today what with all the red tape and regulations, I bet it'd be a bloody nightmare.
You've just described how a hospital works.
It is a nightmare.