Has anyone given a thought to the future shock of getting older and being saddled with small gauge guns and big runnin' dogs?
If your sport needs to cover lots of ground, and you hunt the deserts, tundra and steep hillsides of this land.
That light little gun(410 & 28ga.) makes things easy for now, but what about when old age starts to creep in.
What are you going to do with 'em?
That big runnin' dog is way too much for you, your bladder can't take long trips and the legs have gone south!
Whats your plan?
Mine is, and all my guns are 12s, my dogs are lazy Labs and I hunt 20 yards from where I park the van. DUCK HUNTING!

That's why they make 2" 12 bores and Clumber spaniels Lowell.

My plan is to live in the moment. But just in case I have purchase several 28's and 67's (410) for those long painful days where I hope the quail are dumb.

The funny thing is my father is at that stage now. He is a very fit 77 and he is my hunting partner. I find him reaching for the 410 more often as the years seem to add up. It's not the weight of the gun but the recoil that seems to wear him out. Now we all have a legitimate excuse to tell our wives,.... "this gun is for my golden years honey, honest!"

As I age and non to gracefully either, I've gone to smaller bores and lighter guns. Even duck hunting, went to decoy shooting only and use a 20 with TM and bismuth. Thank the Lord I stocked up several years ago. Most of the the 12s set in the safe.

when my springers start to run too big I threaten them with a clumber spaniel as a replacement. So far the threats have not worked, but I sure love those spaniels.
Steve

Most of my life, I used a 20ga. for grouse and woodcock, a 12ga. SxS for pheasant, and a Rem 1100 for heavy duck loads. Lately, the 12ga. Coggie has been spending more and more time in the safe; I still use it occasionally, just for the pleasure of it. But I have learned that the 20ga. is really all I need, and - at less than 6 lbs. - all I want in the uplands.

Last year I sold my Alumacraft Ducker, gave away my dekes and retired from waterfowling - all the gear-hauling, the bitter cold and advancing arthritis have taken the fun out of it. I still enjoy hunting grouse, woodcock and pheasant with my springer, and skeet shooting in the off months.

Now in my 70th year, I'm very conscious of the gradual erosion of my physical abilities, and every hunting season is more precious than the last. Planning for the future, I have found younger hunting partners strong enough to drag my corpse out of the coverts. And when I get too slow and feeble to shoot behind my springer, I'll get me one of them pointy-type dogs that give you time to pre-mount your gun.

Now thats what I like to hear.....your an inspiration Jack. Not that many folks that are 70 and still hunting springers. I had no idea you could love dogs so much until I found them. I'm hooked.
Steve

Guess I got directly into the group of dead hunters!
My buddy Nikolai Vereshagin - famous mammoth reseacher is 98 now.
Three or four years ago I brought him to waterfowl hunting and he got 12G Francotte, thou he got light Sauer 20G at home. I asked him why he took heavy gun and he answered Heavy Waterfowler is a must!
I'm 48 now and several years ago I began to shoot B-25 Trap heavy gun with 30" bbls. I can hit everything that moves from this gun and I thought the gun weight is about 7 1/2 pounds. At the beginning I felt this gun was pretty heavy to me and especially for walking all day, but today I don't feel its weight. We worked it out together with the gun. I began to shoot snipes over my dog with gun even.
And just imagine what my shock was, when I bought electronic scales several months ago - the weight of the gun was 8 1/4 pounds!
I'm not gonna give it up and I'm gonna hunt with the guns that really can shoot

The reason I bring this up, is that I've just gone thru a comprehensive physical - things are fine for a 59 year old fart and am on no meds.
...but one of my knees is starting to creak.
I'm not sure that hauling a 410 around an Iowa corn field would lighten the load on it.
Not to mention keeping a big runnin' dog in shape with nightly marathon walks.
Duck hunting has its nasty side, and I think keeping warm is it's only draw back.

The older active gents in the field are deer hunters....something to be said for sitting for your game.
They've traded their Parkers for G&H 250-3000s.

Don't make so much of it Lowell. If the mind stays sharp it will always be able to make the legs get going. I could tell you stories all day long of 70+ year old men who are still going strong. My own father is 72 and has had both of his knees replaced twice (he wore the first ones out) and still works 40 hours a week in my steel fabricating shop and then goes dancing every friday night like he is 25. Short of a truely dibilitating condition if there is true desire in your heart you'll find a way.

Bill G.

Hunt as hard as you can as long as you can, then get smarter. Take a son or grandson to do the heavy lifting. They will not mind and will cherish the time with you years later. Besides as you know the real beauty of hunting is not killing but instead watching the dogs, birds, other hunters and the world we live in. Gauge does not matter.

I remember the last Black duck my maternal grandfather killed, when he was 88. He had taught himself to crossfire because his right eye sight was gone. The shot was about 35 yards and the duck hit the water stone dead. He held that duck for a long time and stroked the feathers softly. I think he was telling the duck he would soon be joining him in the next world. God willing I will be able to do the same when I reach 88. He talked about his father and his grandfather, about hunting and just normal everyday things from his youth. Few ducks flew that morning but it is still one of my best days duck hunting ever.

What do you mean future shock, LG? More likely no future shock. The only thing that keeps me from identifying with a dead duck is my feathers aren't nearly so pretty so conclude that the duck probably isn't geriatric.

jack

I'll sell my guns when I'm no longer able to hunt on my own hind legs. Young men feel a need to kill, we old farts have killed enough and are in the game more for the hunt. Sitting on your butt in a deer stand is just killing, not hunting.

I plan on chasing chukars in the scabrock with my 16b until I'm physically unable to, which, if I play my cards right, won't ever be the case. So far so good. And if I should fall and break a hip or worse, so be it. Go down swinging I say. No second chances in life, and no regrets either.

Jack Maloney, its not the need to kill, its the need to have a nice day out.
So if they sit in a stand, or blind - so be it!
I don't want to hang my guns up in the future, just because I can't make the climb anymore.
Wild things, are wild things!
All this is better than the poultry put-put course at the club.

I'm in my 70th year and still enjoy the "hunt". I got my first springer in 1944 and my current 4 year old is a wonderful dog.
For grouse and woodcock I switch from a Darne 20 to a Wm. Evans SLE 2 1/2" 12, depending on weather and conditions. When hunting pheasant my favorite is a 12 bore Greener. When shooting doves and skeet I use a Beretta sxs with choke tubes.

JAB, thanks for a close look at your cabinet!

Lowell, I don't often find your posts either to my interests or ideology, but this one is different and special. KYJON's post of his grandfather is poignant and beautiful. Jack Maloney's post about younger hunting companions both wry and astute. And your own reply to Jack about a good day afield, whether sitting or striding is on the mark. I wish I could say, with all the confidence of youth like that Bill G. kid, that it's mind over matter, but at 62 -- and with a genetic history that points only to 70 -- the matter doesn't always respond. I can only echo Jack, that each season has a weight and specialness that might not have been so apparent a decade ago. Wishing ALL you OLD guys good days afield for years to come. Best, Will

You got that right, Lowell. My longest and oldest friend is 91 and hunts deer now as always with a Savage 250-3000. At 75 I'm more active now than ever chasing ducks. Where once I didn't think about the weight of a gun, now I do. They say the legs are first to go but so far they're just fine. Eating properly and getting lots of exercise daily is key.

Yes. Keep yourself trim. That makes it easy to be active. This afternoon, I spent three hours hiking in my woods through snow that measured an average of 17 inches. At 54 years, it just felt good.

Behind every bush a potty break awaits.

Old legs, and smallbores....

I clicked on here thinking I'd see a picture of Lowell with a crow he'd shot with his Kimber and the cheap scope.

j0ey, "the cheap scope," is a humble reminder to me - you can't always get what you want.
Bet you know this too, with the addition of your Brummie who-dun-it!

Right Lowell! But as Mick continues.........

"You can't always get what you want
But if you try sometimes you just might find
You just might find
You get what you need, ah yes..."

I am 48, I worry about my eyes going more than anything else. Birds I can still see, but the clays are getting kind of hard to spot, especially those roonie stages.

Bob, its just what I need - spot on, and 5 thru a crow's eye at 55.

No brainer: older dogs, more choke, practice long shots at clays.

Sam

Lowell,
I remember my father once drove his car into a field, in which his two sons and a grandson were hunting pheasant.
My brother thought the old man had finally lost it as did my nephew.
Naaw I said, he'll just watch us from a safe distance and he did.
The 10x binos allowed him to watch the dogs and us for several hours.
He was all smiles later on.

Will Garfit actually traded up to a heavier gun when he got older - reconed that a heavieer gun kicked less and was less punishing to shoot.

Might make sense for clays or driven poultry shooting, but not for rough shooting on wild birds. In the field, I spend a hell of a lot more time carrying than shooting - and I've never ever felt "punished" by a shot on wild game. A light game gun with moderate loads is a pleasure to carry all day and more than sufficient for most upland hunting.

A quandry, indeed-do I take the 5lb, 13oz Darne 20, with 29 1/2" tubes, the 6lb Darne 12, with 26" tubes and sling (handy for hypoglycemic old dogs, too), or the 6lb 6oz, Tobin 16, at a nice even 28"? Decisions, decisions. Say, I've a 5lb and change Remington 17, too, and that King's Ferry Ithaca 16 with the alloy receiver can't weigh but 6 and a little bit, either, come to think of it. What does a first year model 12 20 gauge weigh? Can't be much over 6 and a quarter, even with the spiffy, new, non perch belly buttstock. Good heavens, I almost forgot about my snowshoe grouse gun, the Italian "Companion" 12 single, less than 6 by at least 1/2 pound, even with 30" tube.
The way you guys talk, almost leads me to believe I was supposed to be buying heavy 12s all along. What did I miss? I do have a 'coupla down and dirty 12 pumps, that get used for trap league, by big kids at gunsafety class, or anywhere the words "steel shot" get used in reference to hunting birds. Nowhere else, though.
Like I said, almost. When do I get old fart status, by the way? Does 45 years of age count, or do I need a waist bigger than size 32? Still have a complete set of human, adult teeth, if that affects status. Keep me posted.
Best,
Ted

Ted - you're much too young for an under 6 lb. gun. If you don't want folks to mistake you for an old fart, you ought to get rid of that flimsy little Darne 20. Give me a call - I'm in the St. Paul book - and (just as a favor) I might take it off your hands.

Bad news, Jackster-it is just as lefthanded as I am, which, I'm guessing, is more than you are. Not much of a trap gun, with IC and IM chokes, either, but, the birds just don't notice.
Best,
Ted

Ted - When at your age I would have figured maybe 60, but this year I make 55 and believe I've arrived. BTW, don't you know waist size is inversely proportional to years of tenure as an old fart?

Jack M. - Thanks for pointing out the pointy dogs option for later stage geriatrics. I was afraid my bird hunting life would end when I can no longer stay with my springers. With a pointer maybe it wouldn't have to ... but will probably still feel like it has.

Ted, I think of you as an honorary old fart!
Just think of the head start you've had, when you reach old fart status - you'll truely be one!

No prob, a C-note will get that bois torqued from gauche to droit in no time. And I won't even demand the usual discount for frog engineering.

Bad idea to even think of that on a Darne, or, a Charlin, Jack. I have discovered it is just about impossible. But, don't take my word for it-talk to JJ at Champlin, down in Enid.

Better to get the gun with stock pretty close to what you need, and call it good. While I've heard Darnes called many different things, over the years, flimsy isn't one of them.

With proper torque on your head, maybe we can get you bent from right to left, eh? Might work out better, long term....
Best,
Ted

I'm thinking that it may prove more prudent to buy a lighter pair o' boots. Kangaroos come to mind.

For waterfowl, it'll be a 12 w/no more than 1.25oz of shot, thank you, and for most birds afield, pheasants excepted, a 20ga. with 25 grams or 7/8 oz. of #6's does just fine. Dogs that hunt close are a treasure for both young boys and old men.

I was thinking an American Water Spanial would have shorter legs, which, in theory, would slow 'em down enough in heavy cover to call it "close working". Might try one, someday.

My setters, both good pointing dogs, were balls of fire between those points, and set the pace up a notch or two over what I would call close working. It is a challenge on pheasants that have been pressured a bit to keep up in that track meet.

A sub six pound 20 gauge is a joy in the right application, and I have owned the model 17 since I was 16, when I was most assuredly not an old fart, just a lad with a light bird gun. I think of the sub six pound Darne 20, with it's longish barrels, the same way I think of my IRA-proper preparation for the golden years to come, but, a bunch more fun along the way.

So, go find a little gun of your very own, Jack. You don't get mine. I thought that Bernadelimacaroni, or whatever it is that you own, was 'sorta light, but, maybe not light enough.
Best,
Ted

PS TW, I'm thinking most guys here have more weight around their middle they could lose, than the difference between light boots, and not so light boots. Especially the old farts.

Ted - my V. Bernardelli Hemingway comes in at 5lb. 14oz. - just about right for me. But I'm always open to a little French flirtation...

The American water spaniel is an interesting choice, and I have seen a lot of them. But IMHO anything an AWS can do will be learned faster and done better by a field-bred English springer or cocker. If s-l-o-w is your goal, the Clumber spaniel is a perfect old man's dog - a ponderous, powerful close-working flusher that'll root birds out of the thickest cover. And even I can outrun them!

Don't forget your sublingual nitro tabs ole' farts!

Ted - You're right about many younger old farts, not so much for older ones. Surviving older farts beat the large waistband mortality rate. Photos of hunters in the current issue of PF magazine who died before age 60 are sad evidence.