Looking for examples in doubles, as a result of steel shot. (Or even lead shot, for that matter.) What loads, through what guns, have caused problems that you've observed? On the other side of the coin, what loads have worked out for you through what guns? Wondering here in particular about older American guns, plus European guns that are CIP standard rather than superior or magnum proof.
When referring to chokes through which you've shot steel and which have (or have not) resulted in bulges, if possible please specify the constriction if you know it (rather than just mod, full, etc). Thanks!
Larry,
I picked up an old beatup LeFever Single barrel trap gun a few years ago. The trap range I shot at required steel shot, I had the gun rquipped with thin wall choke tubes so I could use modified at the trap range that required steel shot and Full at all the other ranges. One night the modified choke tube came loose while shooting steel shot causing a huge ring bulge and it also blew the choke tube right out of the barrel.
Steve
Good way to get a ring bulge is to leave oil in the barrel before shooting . A close examination of many guns will reveal a slight ring bulge behind the choke cone .Having said that I have measured a lot of Spanish guns [new] that appear to have again slight ring bulges behind the chokes as a result of the way the chokes are formed by swaging or from lapping into the cone . These will I'm sure increase in severity with prolonged use especially if using maximum loads.
I had a Stevens M311 20 ga that I bought new in 1963 or 64. I sold it in the early 80's. It never ever had any steel shot run through it, only lead loads and virtually all one ounce field loads. Way less than a box of three inch 1 1/4 ounce loads. A grand total of maybe 300 shells, probably much less. Both barrels had a very slight ring bulge about one inch back from the muzzles. They were quite slight but nevertheless easily visible. And oily barrels were definitely not the cause or a contributing factor in this case.
How would oil in the barrel cause a ring bulge?
I guess kinda like a garden hose , when you turn the Tap on n you get those hard squirts before everything evens out???
Just a long shot?
But it makes sense, kinda.
franc
To add: the chokes were IC/Mod on 26 inch barrels on the M311. Or so they were marked as I never measured them.
That's where much of the trouble lies; most of the time chokes are much tighter than marked.
Browning still recommends no steel in any of its Belgian-made guns. Chokes, in addition to some guns with fairly thin barrels, probably contribute to the likelihood of ring bulges. I had an A-5 16ga (Standardweight, not a Sweetie) from 1951. Marked mod, but the choke miked out at .025 constriction.
That's pretty graphic. Wonder if it could have been the result of an obstruction rather than the shot charge?
Looks more like an obstruction to me.
really early guns can have too soft steel to use modern plastic wads!! Ron Coleman, fine gunsmith in Dallas, now retired to Colorado, I believe once diagnosed that problem in a turn of the century drilling I once returned to seller. Said no one was at fault--gun was made for cardboard/felt wads, that's all. Steve
That Browning bbl bulge had to be a serious obstruction and likely more than just a stuck wad I'd say. A decent slug of snow maybe. I've seen a few minor bulges in the same area from stuck wads. They can generally be hammered out using a clean leather or small plastic hammer and a set of pin gages. You can't get the part between the ribs of course.
A "puddle" of oil (thick film) could act as an obstruction if it has sufficient weight to slow the shot/wad enough to create a gas hammer.
The plastic wad as a problem is one theory I have not heard before. Usually, it's regarded as an improvement--especially if you're shooting steel shot (which is a no-no in quite a few doubles anyhow) because it protects the bore from the hard pellets.
... They can generally be hammered out using a clean leather or small plastic hammer and a set of pin gages. You can't get the part between the ribs of course.
Richard,
I haven't been successful in removing dents or bulges with a polycarbonate (Lexan) headed hammer, no matter how hard I beat on the barrel. The plastic just seems to absorb all the deflection. I have successfully used a polished brass hammer (the other side of that polycarb hammer) and steel hammers, including steel hammers with commom clear packing tape on the barrel to protect the blueing. It does, however, need more forceful hammering to do the same work. The clear packing tapes are generally Mylar and even the thinnest seems to really help protect a barrel that won't be refinished. I place the tape on the barrel. I recently removed some dents in a .410 this way. A .410 barrel with a similar wallthickness to a 12ga, will be much harder to remove the dent as it acts like a thicker wall, due to the small diameter.
So, my new preference is to use a freshly polished steel hammer with Mylar packing tape. I highly recommend this method to anyone removing dents or bulges. But be aware, even this thin packing tape will require aurprisingly increased force by about double what you'd use with a bare steel hammer.
Proceed with caution removing bulges. Awhile back I bought a set of ejector Fox barrels that had a bad bulge about 12" back from the muzzle of the right barrel. I worked for some time, slowly, removing it with a polished hammer and Mylar tape. I had it all nearly gone, except for that between the ribs, when the top rib popped loose from the incessant pecking near it. I removed the ribs and shipped the barrels to a good doublegun smith to finish removing the bulge, and relay the ribs. After finishing removing the bulge he found a crack where the bulge had been between the ribs.
So, I now have well over three hundred bucks in a set of useless Fox barrels. Oh well, I have some extra parts, and I learned a lesson. I won't mess with bulges that severe anymore. Dents are usually a piece of cake. Bad bulges, not.
SRH