doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Double Rifles, Paradox Guns & Gauge Rifles @ doublegunshop.com Muzzle Loading Purdey Double Rifle questions

Hi All,

I have some questions about a Muzzle Loading Purdey Double Rifle that I saw recently. It is a sidelocked Muzzle loader with very nice foliate scrollwork. The sidelocks are marked 'Purdey'. The Barrel is marked 'J. Purdey 314 1/2" Oxford Street, London' on central rib (what does the ' 314 1/2" ' stand for? is that the address of Purdey...and why the 1/2"...??). The barrel flats are marked interlaced CP with Crown and V with crown and another proof mark alongwith the number 42. The Buttplate has the following written on it 'Charge 3 3/4 Dms No.6 Powder'. The serial # is 74XX dating it to around 1866 according to my research on the web.

Any input would be highly appreciated.

Best regards

Karni

314 1/2 is the address. When a building had two floors occupied by two different businesses they used 1/2 instead of "A" or "B".

Thank you Mike. Was curious about that strange address.

What about the bullet? Is this a bullet or a roundball rifle? I'm asking because I have a Lang percussion double and I'm sort of interested whether it was meant for roundball or a short bullet - the twist is about 54". You are lucky to find one with the charge written on it like that. Mine came with no such clues.

I hope you bought it! I'd love to see pictures if it's possible.

Brent

Brent: I'm going to say both, but it is certainly going to do it's best with conical bullets. This was the twist I first ordered before I was told it was better to go Round ball in my case it was for .6750 bore or aka 16 ga. the twist then had to go to 1 turn in 95".

I can give you a contact number if you would like to talk to a builder that can explain it all. I admit to being a little out of my league with this stuff.

If you still have my e-mail Addy, shoot one off to me.

Hi Brent. Not very knowledgeable about these things. It has tools to both make a conical bullet and a round ball. It has two wide grooves in the barrel, but I dont know the twist specs. Any ideas on how I may determine the bore size? Shouldnt it be marked somewhere?

Its almost a replica of this Rifle at http://www.sitemason.com/page/hWxCU0 with slight difference in the carving design and doesnt have damascus barrels. In all other aspects the rifles are similar. Period is also about the same as the serial numbers are pretty close. Though the one I saw is in poorer condition (as it has seen a lot more use).

UPDATE

Correction on my post above....I just checked the barrels again today and it seems they are Damascus after all, as one can very faintly see the pattern under the blueing. The Damascus pattern is distinct and design of the pattern is similar to the Rifle linked above.

What are the things to keep in mind while trying to evaluate Damascus barrels for wear weaknesses etc. ? Any inputs would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance :).

ksbhati,
There may be a proof mark that will tell you the bore diameter, but frankly, mine is off by quite a bit and even at best, it's likely only "in the ballpark". So, you need to slug this yourself. There are a couple of ways to do this but here is what have done in the past several times.

1. find a big enough hunk of soft lead. That's the hard part.

2. Find a goodly sized chunk of brass, aluminum or copper pipe. 3/8" or so would work. An aluminum arrow might work in a pinch. 1/2" copper water pipe might work best.

3. Poor the pipe full of lead. 6" of 1/2" pip will work. I used something a bit smaller in diameter and about that length.

4. put the lead-filled pipe in the bore.

5. tap the oversized lead slug into the bore to get it to conform to the rifling.

6. Turn the rifle upside down and mildly shake it up and down using the pipe in the bore to tap out the slug - onto carpet so it's undamaged.

You may feel better wrapping the pipe with tape first. I don't think it is at all necessary, but it may make you feel better.


Now, with your slug in hand, you can search for a bullet or ball - though measuring the pitch of the rifling would be helpful.

If a roundball seems reasonable, you may wish to buy a scissor mold from Dixiegunworks.com. They are about $35 and come in 0.05" increments to any size that you can conceive of shooting. And while cheap as all get out, mine casts the best roundball I've ever seen.

As for inspecting the damascus - look for pits for sure, but you may wish to have a competent smith look at it. I would be more concerned about the nipple's fit and any corrosion in that area.

Al, et al. I have shot roundballs in mine but find it regulates with only 40 gr or so of powder. I gotta believe that it could do better than that. I have some samples of a .630" "Rigby bullet" from an NEI mold that I will try. They are quite short and may be ideal for this gun. Gotta find the time to do this however.

Brent

Hi !

Just did a quick measurement of the rifle bore at the tip with a scale (sorry Brent cant do as you instructed unless I buy the rifle). It measures exactly .50" or 1.2cm. So would that make this a .50 Caliber rifle ? I also measured the dia of the Conical bullet mould and that is also .50" or 1.2cm.

The proof marks have a number 42 as mentioned above and there is another faint number which looks like a 4 .

Sounds about right, but I don't have my conversion tables handy. Anyway, if it comes with a mould, then you are in business. Sounds like you need to get her bought and home!

Brent