doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com First Parker - Sorta

"Limiting onesself to the use of more modern guns simply based on the ignorance of the many alternatives to steel for waterfowl is rather sad and prevents one from enjoying full use of old original Parkers and other fine doubles."

Let's see. I think I was just called ignorant. DAM16 I am sure you represent the truly knowledgable wing of the smoothbore community, and I am so grateful for your informed observations. Heck, I have only fooled around with SxS's and combination guns for about 45 years, and only own about a dozen really nice ones. So thanks for pointing out the limitations of my shotgunning enjoyment experience.

However, my actual motivation for this purchase was hunting in Canada, which I do each fall. A problem with the "many alternatives" to steel is that one may only transport so many rounds to Canada, and gun-friendly alternative loads are virtually impossible to acquire once in country. Therefore, using a SXS can be a little tricky. My travel gun had been a Ruger Gold. It will now be the Parker Rep SSS. I think it will be about ideal for task.

Will let you know if it doesn't measure up from an experience stand point.

The tungsten matrix party is just about over. Market metal prices and transportation costs are working against it being a viable alternative for shooting steel. Ditto bismuth. The industrial users of both of these metals can and will pay much more for them than shooters will.

The truth is, there are FEW altenatives to steel and the market has just about taken those away.

Larry, some folks MIGHT be willing to let a London built pigeon gun travel in the duck boat. But, I don't know any of them. What you are describing is a fairly rare and very expensive gun, in any event. Those tungsten loads are way, way up there on pressure as well. Just because an old, expensive, London fowler was proofed at that level, 75 years past, are we to be comfortable subjecting it, on a regular basis, to that level of pressure today?

Ignorant, here and now, is not understanding, just how limited old doubles, of any type, are going to be in the very near future. Steel loads, and the pressures generated in "useful" hunting ammunition of same, will conspire to rob us of the use of most of those old guns.

Mr. Taylor, I congatulate you on your grasp of the conditions we all face, that at least a few are beginning to understand.
Best,
Ted

It's getting to be the case that if you want to shoot a SxS on ducks at less than $4/shell (just wait to you see the prices this fall), then you'd better have a gun that can take both steel and high pressures. If you hunt one or two days every week for a 108 day season, the price of non-tox shells for the season can equal the price of a decent autoloading duck gun. Even in big cities like Los Angeles, you usually can't find the exact non-tox shells you need when you need them, and Cabela's and Mack's are invariably back ordered on whatever you need, so back to steel. My SxS steel shot special is a P. Bernardelli with 3" chambers and choke tubes. If it falls out of the boat, I'll use my BSS. Using a Parker or Elsie for regular waterfowling is like wearing a tuxedo to dinner; nice every once in a while, but not something I want to do every day. I would do it every day if I could still shoot lead.

This must be gem of a gun. I had poor man's version called 'Classic Doubles' 201 with tubes and that was a hard hittin gun. Congratulations.

Why do you say that, and how do you know that?


I say it because it's true. I speak the truth, brother. I know it because I have owned and do owned many of each.

If the Japanese made a copy of a 1931 Deusenberg it might well last longer and look just as good. But, like any product made in Japan it would have absolutely no soul.

[quote=Joe Taylor
Let's see. I think I was just called ignorant. DAM16 I am sure you represent the truly knowledgable wing of the smoothbore community, and I am so grateful for your informed observations. Heck, I have only fooled around with SxS's and combination guns for about 45 years, and only own about a dozen really nice ones. So thanks for pointing out the limitations of my shotgunning enjoyment experience.

stand point. [/quote]

On the contrary Joe, I applaud your decision to buy the Parker Ropro SSS. I have a few Parker Repros as well and enjoy them thoroughly and have several original Parkers too. I really wasn't calling anyone "ignorant" and threw out that word simply to bring to the forefront the various possibilities of alternative shot choices to use in old waterfowling guns. Despite the continuous rise in cost of these alternative choices they still remain a viable choice for those of us who choose to use our old fowlers for whatever reason we are compelled to do so. Nothing against new guns either. They certainly fit the bill for those who simply need to have their bill fitted and are not enamoured of the wonderful oldies. I must confess to being "ignorant" in probably a lot of things and if, after reading what I have written here, anyone feels insulted by being called "ignorant" well, if the shoe fits. . .

Joe, I'm sure you will really enjoy your SSS, they are a great gun and combine the best of both worlds, beauty with functionality and modern, proven metals.

Dean Romig

How does this soul thing work, Greg? The Japanese have a distinguished record in manufacturing sporting guns. So do many other countries. Could a great Chinese double have "soul"? I think SKB may have been around as long as Winchester.

Ted, you probably need to check prices on those Repro Steel Shot Specials. They ain't exactly Stevens 311's. Anyone that would be willing to take a Repro on a duck hunt would probably be willing to take a Brit double.

As for the TM pressure issue . . . yes, that would indeed be a problem, IF one were to shoot the Kent loads made for the American market. However, right in front of me I'm looking at a box of Kent "Impact" TM loads. 2 1/2" shells, "fibre" wads (those darned Brits can't spell!), #5 shot--which splashed whole bunches of ducks back in the lead shot days. And the box further confirms that they are suitable for use in guns with a 3 ton or 850 bar proof. I have shot them on pheasants in my 2 1/2" Brit guns, on those rare occasions when I venture into areas requiring nontox for ringnecks.

Too bad they've gotten so darned expensive. But then so has lead. Pretty soon the steel Nazis may convert us all not because steel is better, but because it's cheaper!

That's snobbish BS!

No it's not. If you've ever driven a Lexus, or a Honda, you'll know what I mean. Perfectly functional and perform as they should but no soul. In 25 years will people be collecting Toyota Corollas? Of course not. They're appliances.

I don't care if Japanese guns been around since time began. No soul. I can't believe I'm having to explain this to a crowd that cherishes 120 year British guns that no one even is sure who made them.

If you don't know what I mean, go find your local Harley Davidson chapter and explain to them that a Japanese bike would be a better choice. They'll teach ya better than I can.