doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com More about the lead controversy

We had a large subdivision go up nearby a few years ago. After it was completed and people were living in all of the houses, someone remembered that there was a skeet shooting range there back in the 50s and 60s. They made the developer come back and replace all of the soil from all the yards after testing the soil and finding a high lead content.........Have any of you watched hunting shows on TV and seen how many of the target ranges have the shot going out into the water of a lake or pond? I always wondered about that, too.

If the Bald Eagle was picked as a poster bird for the lead shot restrictions, then the people who picked it new very little about what Bald Eagles ate. Mainly they are carrion eaters, and fish eaters. Not like their cousin the Golden Eagle a true hunter. The Bald Eagle was picked because it is our national symbol, so who better to pick for it.
As far as the other raptors increasing in numbers it is mainly due to the ban on shooting them, although West Nile Virus is taking quite a few.
The only raptors capable of getting lead poisoning are the ones capable of catching ducks and that would leave only the Prairire Falcon, Peregrine Falcon, Gyr Falcon and possibly the Goshawk.

It's a shame that we have little to say when the law makers pass such laws with little known facts that are presented to them. An example would be the ban on bear hunting in New Jersey 2 years ago during an election year. The topic was brought up about letting a hunt on that they desperatly needed in the state according to the biologists. Nothing was done during the election because of votes. After the election, the new governor nixed it becasue of the animal lovers that voted for him. So why have biologists on hand to pay them for their work when what they say is not heard. The lead banning is the same, except now it is Federal law. I quess they should know, right? Don't think so.

I think the main element on bringing back the population of the Bald Eagle was the banning of pestisides. Not lead shot. Eagles were picking up the pestisides from the fish they were eating. I watched a show on this a few weeks ago. They never mentioned anything about lead shot.

All this talk about lead poisoning has me damn scared...

See, when I was around 14 or so, I got peppered pretty good on a dove hunt by some inexperienced hunter nearby. The LEAD shot is still in me and 28 years later I am still alive --not to mention all those lead fillings in my teeth. Doctors said that the lead pellets would not do me any harm and the dentist said my fillings are safe where they are.

But you guys make me think they are liars. So should l die soon, please, please, please do not let any of those raptors, eagles, or California condors eat my dead, rotting corpse or pick at my teeth --God forbid they get lead poisoning.

In fact, come to think of it, I might have to be buried in some kind of special casket designed by the EPA so I don't contaminate the ground water or something...

NUTS...

I'm with you David, I accidentally jammed a pencil lead in my hand in Jr. High. Black dot is still there 25 years later and not once have I thought about amputating (to save the raptors). Got 3-4 of those lead fillings in my mouth too - only side effect... I can pick up the local country station on a clear day. Makes me sing Hank Jr. songs ALL day long.

Seriously though... this lead discussion is fascinating to me. Keep up the fight to get out useful and accurate info.

David, I think those fillings are dental amalgam, not lead. Maybe they contain lead, but it was my understanding that some concern exists because they contain a small amount of mercury. But I've got a bunch of them too, have a couple decades on you, and am not worried about them--as long as I keep my teeth!

JDW, the bald eagle deal was indeed specifically related to carrion-eating. Remember, that was in the days before the lead restrictions, so if you shot a duck, pheasant, whatever, crippled or dead but not recovered, an eagle might end up eating it and ingesting lead. Some apparently did. Today, any raptor capable of catching a duck wouldn't ingest any lead, because a) we don't shoot them with lead any more; and b) if they already have shot in them, then it'd be the carrion eaters that would be ingesting the shot (whether steel or other nontox in the case of a duck, maybe lead in the case of a pheasant), not the raptors taking healthy birds on the wing.

Larry, you are being much to simple minded about eagles as you well know.

I agree that the jury is out on all kinds of things but that accidental ingestion of lead shot was an important source of mortality in waterfowl, eagles, condors, and perhaps doves is not. For other birds, hard to say just yet. The definitive data on population level responses is hard beyond belief to get - and expensive.

Larry, have you ever watched winter eagles in places like Kansas, or even the east coast of Iowa? One of their staple foods is duck - wounded or otherwise, but wounded particularly. I have watched them countless times in Kansas where I was ducking in the 80s.

Brent

I am a dentist and deal regularly with the consequences of what I like to call the current age, otherwise known as the" New Dark Ages", or "The Rise of Pseudoscience". Between lead, mercury and fluoride, the yah-hoo's have been torturing my profession (and our integrity I might add) mercilessly for years. And it continues as the uneducated masses yearn for easy answers to everything, particularly the tough questions, and the ignorant but therefore easily controllable youth we have pumped out and amused suck in for the lastest "finding". Here here to real science. Good luck to us all!!
Rick

The science used against lead shot is unrefutable. Banning pesticides had much less to do with improving Eagle populations. Lead shot is a huge threat to the ecosystem, ban it all!!

Perhaps we could change the discussion to something lighter, soemthing proven beyond doubt, with fewer skeptics, like Global Warming...............

Hey, how about them politicians?