doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Joseph Smets Nickel Toledo steel

Just received this 16ga Joseph Smets 7lbs 30in barrels. Proofed 1926 but looks like Turnbull restored a decade or so ago, just a few nicks. Any info on Joseph Smets and or Nickel Toledo steel barrels. Not much info out there. Thanks

Barrel has a small HG mark. Who made actions like this one ? Britte? Internal parts are gold washed also. Seems high grade but not much engraving. Choked full/full

A Google search on Jno. Hy. Andrews Toledo Steel flagged up a Holts sale entry for another high quality Belgian made H. Mahillon SLE using these tubes, as well as a Hallowells listing for a similar gun by Forgeron .

Interesting that at a time when British and American gunmakers were routinely importing German and Belgian made tubes at least one British steel maker was supplying tubes to Belgian gun makers.

I believe that Whitworth barrels are also found occasionally on high quality European shotguns.

JNO. HY. ANDREW & CO. LTD. TOLEDO STEEL WORKS SHEFFIELD appears on high grade between the wars doubles of several Liege makers; including Verney-Carron, Jules Bury, Nicolas Lajot, L. Christophe & F. Thonon. I don't have a composition analysis, but in light of the 'Belgian Best' makers using the tubes it was no doubt good stuff.
It is unclear if the tubes were manufactured in Liege or England
https://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=450711

I would have to re-read a bit & refresh, but the probability of >>JNO. HY. ANDREW & CO. LTD. TOLEDO STEEL WORKS SHEFFIELD<< shipping Bar Stock to Liege pretty much approaches Zero. All other Steel Makers, and many Mechanics, filed for trademarks & had licensing agreements with Belgian Steel Makers in Flanders and Wallonia, and any one familiar w/ Belgian platforms would easily recognize those steel centres. Although the Belgian Steel effort could be in a slump today, Belgium is highly known for being a major steel producer in Europe. Major steel makers like Krupp, would make licensing agreements to produce their bar stock for tube production. I am fairly confident that the American & German Outfitters were behind the licensing effort??

During the aforementioned era, pretty much everything in Belgium supported the weapons effort.

Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

Can you tell us what is at the end of the tube text past >>Sheffield<<, which is encirlced?


Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

Toledo steel markings are found on many higher end Belgian guns.

Even today, the beloved German firm of H&K sources a blank that is made from French Bar stock of Cannon Steel origin, some unique cannon alloy, to bore and send to the U.S. of A. to have their pistols made in Columbus, Georgia down in Ford's area. This avoids tariffs & import/export issues(maybe evening circumventing Proof Laws??). I do wonder if they have read or are following the Schoverling, Daly & Gales modell????

Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

Lovely „Purdey Nose“, for you Anglophiles, which is seen on Upper Rung Belgian offerings. I personally think the „Fermeture Liègeoise“ - >>Galand Nose<< is found on Belgian Best Guns??
You can always tell by the >>X<< extractor face configuration & the odd, thin bar concealed in the standing breech.




https://www.doublegunshop.com/forum...;Words=galand&Search=true#Post657817


Ford must be doing consulting work @ the HK plant in Columbus, Georgia as I have not seen his fingerprints lately..... I must check on him.

Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

Only found 2 j. Smets guns on web plus the littlegun info. Here are the locks

[quote=ellenbr]

Can you tell us what is at the end of the tube text past >>Sheffield<<, which is encirlced?


Works Sheffield N-

Belgian / French initials are many times perplexing just because of the order HG/GH....


H. Giltay

??? Arnold à Liège

BTE Arnold à Liège

Mat(Mathias) Arnold à Liège

https://www.littlegun.be/arme%20belge/artisans%20identifies%20g/a%20giltay%20h%20gb.htm

Have no idea and not sure if the time frames overlap.

Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

When it comes to the forgings, I am confident that the sources were few. Frame Files & Actioners just may be under a broad umbrella. Many times in the corners of the water-table a Belgian mechanic left their fingerprints.

Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

Just search for a HG/GH Mechanic that leaves his fingerprints on tubes....


Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

I just looked on a Nelson Steel Belgian tubeset & I found the initials of >>DG<<; maybe they were of the same family of tube makers and the name is actually HG on the Smets.

Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

Yes small HG

But many times the names on guns of French Speaking origin have the initials reversed like on some Bohemian Guns, well @ least their proper names....


Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

Thanks. Will surf hg go later when I get back in from shooting this afternoon. I like it, it fits. Now will put it to the test. Thanks everyone.