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VL&D model ID #670768 01/29/26 09:45 AM
Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 126 Likes: 13 Mentor, Ohio DaveB OP Sidelock
OP DaveB Sidelock Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 126 Likes: 13 Mentor, Ohio	I have just won an auction for a VL&D Francotte. It is a 20 gauge, side plated box lock ejector. The gun was proved in 1934 according to the proof code "m" on the flats. I was hoping someone could help identify what model this gun is. I assume it is a number 20 or 25 quality, but I don't see any marking as such on the gun. I have attached a few photos for reference. Any insights would be greatly appreciated. Last edited by DaveB; 01/29/26 09:45 AM.
	1 member likes this: Ted Schefelbein

Re: VL&D model ID DaveB #670769 01/29/26 09:47 AM
Joined: Dec 2001 Posts: 7,415 Likes: 741 Colorado SKB Sidelock
SKB Sidelock Joined: Dec 2001 Posts: 7,415 Likes: 741 Colorado	I can't help at all with your question, that is a lovely shotgun though. Francottes are very well made guns. Enjoy it in good health. www.bertramandco.com consignments, imports, sales
	1 member likes this: DaveB

Re: VL&D model ID DaveB #670771 01/29/26 09:54 AM
Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 9,867 Likes: 508 AZ but dreaming of KS Drew Hause Sidelock
Drew Hause Sidelock Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 9,867 Likes: 508 AZ but dreaming of KS	Cornell Pubs has a 1927-28 VL&D catalog repro that lists the 20, 25 & 30 https://cornellpubs.com/product/999/ https://sites.google.com/a/damascusknowledge.com/www/home
	1 member likes this: DaveB

Re: VL&D model ID DaveB #670777 01/29/26 10:27 AM
Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 671 Likes: 14 Alaska Little Creek Sidelock
Little Creek Sidelock Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 671 Likes: 14 Alaska	The engraving style appears to be of a Model 20 sideplated boxlock. Some (occassional) Francottes have a model number stamped on the water table. Interesting that it is a VL&D import in 1934. Abercrombie and Fitch took over VL&D import business in about 1929... Nice looking gun!
	1 member likes this: DaveB

Re: VL&D model ID Little Creek #670779 01/29/26 10:46 AM
Joined: Feb 2002 Posts: 14,547 Likes: 309 Maryland eightbore Sidelock
eightbore Sidelock Joined: Feb 2002 Posts: 14,547 Likes: 309 Maryland	I have owned Francottes for decades, never saw a grade mark on one, except Knockabouts. Yours looks like a grade 20.

Re: VL&D model ID Little Creek #670780 01/29/26 10:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 126 Likes: 13 Mentor, Ohio DaveB OP Sidelock
OP DaveB Sidelock Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 126 Likes: 13 Mentor, Ohio	Originally Posted by Little Creek The engraving style appears to be of a Model 20 sideplated boxlock. Some (occassional) Francottes have a model number stamped on the water table. Interesting that it is a VL&D import in 1934. Abercrombie and Fitch took over VL&D import business in about 1929... Nice looking gun! Thank you, I really like the engraving and the gun handles really well. Unfortunately, no model number stamps on the water table. My understanding is that Abercrombie & Fitch still marked the guns VL&D until the mid-30's.

Re: VL&D model ID DaveB #670821 01/30/26 10:03 AM
Joined: Feb 2002 Posts: 14,547 Likes: 309 Maryland eightbore Sidelock
eightbore Sidelock Joined: Feb 2002 Posts: 14,547 Likes: 309 Maryland	Do I recall correctly that A&F was in New York and V L & D was in Chicago, until all the outlets were A&F?

Re: VL&D model ID DaveB #670823 01/30/26 10:18 AM
Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 126 Likes: 13 Mentor, Ohio DaveB OP Sidelock
OP DaveB Sidelock Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 126 Likes: 13 Mentor, Ohio	VL&D was based in New York, but had a branch in Chicago. VL&A. Some good information on the below thread. VL&D thread

Re: VL&D model ID DaveB #670824 01/30/26 10:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 9,867 Likes: 508 AZ but dreaming of KS Drew Hause Sidelock
Drew Hause Sidelock Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 9,867 Likes: 508 AZ but dreaming of KS	Yep https://sites.google.com/a/damascusknowledge.com/www/home
	1 member likes this: DaveB

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