doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion German & Austrian Sporting Guns @ doublegunshop.com Help with the scope base on my Miller&Greiss combo

Reloading manuals generally recommend reducing your load if you change any component, including primers. Then you watch for signs of high pressure like flattened primers or sticky extraction as you work your way back up.

I've had changes in accuracy just by switching primer brands, so there can apparently be a difference.

BillK,
I agree, in principle, with Keith's caution, however when dealing with old "tip up" combination guns and single shot rifles, you may have pressures too high for the gun before traditional pressure signs show up.

Thank you Keith. So, is the general suggestion in this case to reduce the load by 10% and then work yourself up?
BillK

Personally, an accurate load that occurs at less than any maximum load would be my primary consideration. If I started at 10% less and as I increased it the accuracy became worse I would consider decreasing the load some more. Then I would try a different powder. The ideal would be to arrive at an accurate reasonable load that also was close to matching the iron sights in case the scope was not in play.

Yeah, if you are unfamiliar with any of your loading components or a mix thereof, I would start with one loaded round @ say 15% lower and see what the velocity might be. Too, check the primer for any issues. Then work you way forward.

Remember it backs out of the case somewhat due to pressure on ignition then the case under pressure is forced back against the standing breech and the primer is pressed back in place.

Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

Velocity will tell you a lot......

Hochachtungsvoll,

Raimey
rse

The 10% reduction seems to be a generally accepted rule. But as Mike says, there are weaker action types that might fail or sustain damage before some pressure signs appear. Then there may be other factors that could come into play, such as problems that arise when powder volume reductions are made with some powders that already occupy a small volume of the case. There are certain powders such as WW 296 and H 100 that may cause pressure excursions when loads are reduced too much. With some loads, performance may vary due to position of the powder in the case, and sometimes this is prevented by using fillers such as Dacron, for example. In those instances, it it probably wise to stick to known and tested loads using the recommended components.

Fortunately, most reloading data has become more cautious and conservative over time, likely due to liability concerns. And it pays to consult multiple sources to confirm the loading data you are using is safe. Typically, there is a certain margin of safety built into loading data, and no legitimate reloading manual is going to recommend loads that go to the extreme of blowing up commonly used firearms. The internet has made finding load data much easier than in the past, but errors and misinformation can be posted online, so one should always confirm that a new load is legitimate and safe. Anyone on the internet can pose as an expert, so take time to verify. I've known some guys who start at maximum, and work their way up until they see pressure signs. Veering off the road and speeding into the weeds is just asking for trouble. I'm happy with a safe reasonable load that gives me the best accuracy. I've killed enough game with a lowly roundball moving roughly 1800 fps out of a flintlock to know I don't need barrel melting speed.

Since "pressure signs" may not show until the pressure is too high, I also believe that velocity is important data, especially if "factory" velocity is known. If That is not known, but the bullet weight is, I try to find a load that will "follow the sights" (assuming they are known to not have been changed). Mounting a scope on a gun that already has had the barrels regulated often disturbs the regulation so the load should be matched to the open sights, then the scope (if any) can be adjusted to sight it in.
Mike

Thank you Mike.

Update. I am happy to announce I got my combo gun back from Mr. JJ Perodeau. He was able to customize some Warne quick detach rings to mount my scope on the original mounting base the gun has. He zeroed the scope dead center at 50 meters with some ammo he had from Buffalo Arms. Putting the scope on and taking it off is not as fast as a scope equipped with a claw mounting system, but this solution will do and it did not break the bank. Also, I had Mr Perodeau strip and clean and evaluate the gun. He said everything functions properly and all internal parts were highly polished, indicating it is of very good quality. He found out the firing pin for the rifled barrel was broken and he made and fitted a new one. I was able to purchase some rounds from Reed’s Ammo a few years ago, and I am very excited to finally being able to shot this gun. It is a long journey since I purchased it back in 2016 but because of personal reasons and lack of knowledge, it just sat in my gun safe. Thanks to your assistance and knowledge with your comments, I have started gathering the tools and components needed to learn hand loading for this cartridge. I also purchased a chronograph to measure the velocity of the Reed’s Ammo I have on hand and to use it as a reference for my future hand loads. Any additional guidance and information you can still share with me, would be most welcomed. I will keep you posted if my endeavor. Thank you. BillK